I like that idea, but….. I think there is too much weight there now with just 4 125 Trojans and a starting battery…. slight list to starboard….. I think lower and center is better, just can’t think of a place…… I have wet cells…
alan

— On Wed, 1/21/09, Lee Yonkers <> wrote:

Previous owner had built 2 story battery boxes on each side. They're like steps. I have wet cells. Works OK..

Rick

On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 8:46 PM, Lee Yonkers < ([email][/email])> wrote:

Like many of you, I have been looking for a better location for my house bank batteries. I currently have four 135 amp 6volt AGM batteries stored in the two wooden boxes in the starboard lazerette. I want to add four more batteries to double the total amps now available. I am thinking that if I remove the existing battery boxes I will have enough room to build a vertical battery box (two batteries on the lower level with two more sitting on top of the first pair) attached to the existing bulkheads in the engine room. By my calculations the bulk head is at least 26 inches wide and more than 24 inches high, which is more than enough room for my batteries. Access to the batteries will be available by removing the aft cover. I'll treat each side as separate banks.

What do you think? Is this workable? What are the drawbacks and hazards?

Lee

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I have two 4-Ds in the standard starboard battery boxes and 2 4-Ds in the locker aft of the water heater. Three 4-Ds are the house bank, 1 4-D is the reserve bank. I use the Xantrex 2000 as a monitor/controller and the Freedom 2000 inverter/charger attached to the house bank and the echo charger attached to the reserve bank.

I think either Tor or Rich or Walter have moved all their batteries to the locker aft of the water heater using 4 6 volt traction batteries.

All my batteries are AGM.

I would like to move the lazerette batteries lower down but lack the room anywhere to put them. I have an idea – build a bench for the nav station that holds them but it is way down the list of stuff I have to do.

Bob

—
Bob Fine
s/v Pelican
Hull #8

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Lee,

In my opinion the cockpit locker is not an ideal place for batteries, especially a lot of batteries. The weight is too far from the boat’s center of gravity, and you can only access them by opening the hatch and exposing them to the weather – or flying sea spray, as the case may be. Some portion of a sea breaking into the cockpit might conceivably force its way down there and short out the whole bank. Muy malo.

My solution was to leave those original compartments as storage boxes, at least for now, and put 5 new Group 31 AGM’s into the locker just aft of the water heater, beneath the inboard aftermost corner of the aft cabin bunk (photo attached – the pipe and rope are for lifting the batteries out).

Upsides:
– The weight is lower and further forward, as it should be.
– The batteries are out of the weather.
– They’re close to the alternator, but not exposed to the engine’s heat,
– and they’re only a little farther from the battery selector switch under the nav table than was the original location.

Downsides:
– This location lacks adequate ventilation for wet-cell batteries, although that could probably be remedied.
– Five Group 31’s pack in there like sardines which, once done, is actually a good thing. If you decide to go this route, let me know and I’ll spare you a week’s worth of head-scratching and experimenting to get them all in there.

I also installed a single AGM Group 27 starter battery in the bottom inboard corner of the tall locker to starboard of the companionway ladder. That’s an even more ideal location for batteries, being closer to the electric panel, but I didn’t want to give up the whole locker. Lastly, I have another AGM Group 27 battery mounted just aft of the forward water tank, low down and to port, to power an electric windlass.

Tor
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We’ve had this discussion before. Please excuse me if I sound like I’m repeating myself. I moved my house batteries to the bilge shelf just forward of the sump. I removed the battery box in the starboard locker and glassed in a new box. The downside is that severe flooding could submerge your batteries. If it floods enough to submerge the batteries, the engine and related machinery will be partially submerged too, so you have bigger problems than a damaged battery. BTW, the batteries will still work, they just won’t charge. I know this because I had this happen to my dinghy battery. Dunking isn’t an issue with sealed batteries like AGM.

Putting the batteries over the keel puts the weight where it does some good and frees up quite a lot of storage space. The compartment is huge. There’s stuff down there that we never see unless we clean out the locker. Its a bit of a run from the selector switch, but 2/0 wire can handle the load.

I keep a starter battery on the shelf inside the aft hanging locker. Even if the main bank gets submerged, I can still start the engine, assuming that the dipstick doesn’t leak water into the crankcase.

Rich
BlackSheep #47

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Hi Rich,

I'm sure you have a link to the pictures of this. Would you mind providing it (again)?

Thanks,

Bob

On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 9:04 AM, < ([email][/email])> wrote:

That makes a lot of sense, Rich, especially the nearness to center of gravity (and the 2/0 cable). If I didn’t have a holding tank under there…

Tor
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

hey all-
I left my house batteries in the starboard locker (4 Trojan T105s) and added a starting battery located in the engine compartment, just aft of the engine on the port side. I mounted a battery box easily in there and put an Optima AGM as starter batt. The original Optima lasted over 10 years, so the heat from the engine compartment didn’t do it any harm. Another advantage is a relatively short run to the Starter solenoid.

Rodd

p { margin: 0; }Bob
I don’t have photos of the installation. I should probably take a couple and post them. I’ll do so when it warms up and I get the energy to start working on spring projects. Its pretty straightforward. There’s enough room under there for golf-cart height batteries. I made the box to hold four of them. I wish I had the foresight to make the box a little larger. I came across a great price on large AGM batteries (approx $50ea, but the), but I can only fit a pair of them in there and a pair of golf-cart batteries. A couple of more inches of depth and I could have put 4 AGMs in there.

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Rich you’ve just described what I think is the ideal location. When I get to this project I will definitely ping for more details!

Thanks,
-p

<.. snip>

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Rich:

Since I removed my holding tank when I installed the composting toilet, I
also have the space on top of the keel aft of the mast free. I am thinking
of either installing additional fuel tankage or batteries there. How are you
accessing the batteries to top off the water in that spot. Do you have to
move them out or have you found another way to service them.

Thanks,

Paul

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You’ll have a permanent list.
Rich

Paul
AGM batteries are sealed, so there’s no maintenance. I have two flooded
cells in there too, so I must service them once each season. I can slide
the batteries aft far enough to lift them out of the box. Once out, I can
clean out the battery box, wipe down the batteries, and top them off. Its
fairly easy to do but I wouldn’t want to do it each week. When the
batteries are stowed, a wooden brace runs across the top of the batteries
and holds them in place. If the boat were to roll over, the batteries
wouldn’t fall out. There’s about 300 lbs of batteries down there. You
don’t want them tossiing around the cabin. The access hatches lock into
position too.

If I had it to do again, I might cut another access hatch in the cabin sole
beneath the galley table and glass the box in there. This would probably
require removal of the table to service the batteries, but that’s done each
season anyway.

Regards
Rich

As an aside, which may or may not be helpful, here's a link to opening the space under there without moving the table.

http://thesailinglife.blogspot.com/2008/11/there-is-never-enough-space.html

Bob

On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 8:41 PM, Rich Carter < ([email][/email])> wrote:

Bob,
Great job & thanks for publishing the process. I've bookmarked it so I can refer to it when I start a similar project next summer or winter (where I don't know).
Were you able to completely cut out the cabin sole with the Dremel tool? I've used a similar tool from Fein ($$$), but I think it would take forever get through the sole with that tool. I think I'll invest in the Dremel.

John

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 8:15 AM, Robert Fine < ([email][/email])> wrote:

Hey, John,

Thanks. No, most of the cuts were made with a 6″ circular saw with a fine blade. The cuts were stopped when the blade hit the corner. The Dremel tool was used to finish the corner cuts. It took about two minutes per corner. The circular saw blade was just the tiniest bit deeper than the thickness of the floorboards.

We used the blue painter's tape to outline the cuts. The Dremel tool is definitely worth the $99.

Bob

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 8:30 AM, John Stevenson < ([email][/email])> wrote:

For those battery installations that make wet-cell battery access difficult you might consider a product like Qwik-Fill.
http://www.flow-rite.com/pro-fill/index.html?open_menu=0&sub_menu=1
This came up on the SSCA Forum recently. It looks like the current product is limited to smaller batteries (group 27 and smaller). They make a product, Pro-Fill, for 9-volt batteries. This would allow you to maintain proper water level in the batteries without having direct access to the battery valves. The products were designed for small power boats and golf carts so I have no idea what happens on a sailboat that is heeled 15 degrees or more.

I have considered stacking batteries as other have suggested in this thread. Something like this product might make that practical for wet-cells, which I prefer to AGM and Gel. However, I would likely go to those alternatives for a stacked or tightly spaced installation.

John

On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 8:10 AM, Robert Fine < ([email][/email])> wrote:

I have two 4-Ds in the standard starboard battery boxes and 2 4-Ds in the locker aft of the water heater. Three 4-Ds are the house bank, 1 4-D is the reserve bank. I use the Xantrex 2000 as a monitor/controller and the Freedom 2000 inverter/charger attached to the house bank and the echo charger attached to the reserve bank.

I think either Tor or Rich or Walter have moved all their batteries to the locker aft of the water heater using 4 6 volt traction batteries.

All my batteries are AGM.

I would like to move the lazerette batteries lower down but lack the room anywhere to put them. I have an idea – build a bench for the nav station that holds them but it is way down the list of stuff I have to do.

Bob

—
Bob Fine
s/v Pelican
Hull #8

—
Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.com

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John-
We have two banks of four golf car wet cells on Clairebuoyant, one just behind where the 4Ds used to be, and one under the qtr berth. The quik-fill idea is interesting, but I wonder how well it would work if you try to run an equalizing mode on the batteries, with attendant gassing.
The boat has kind of evolvedrebattery location. first four golf car batteries in the original 4Ds location, then four in a box over the keel like Rich. When we reinstalled a holding tank and a DC genset (currently disfunctional) where the 4Ds used to be, we built fiberglass boxes at the present locations.
Quent
Clairebuoyant, lying Velcro Beach, FL