Try epoxy-ing vertical half-pipes (a la Bruce Bingham) or laminating 3/4″ cleats in place (I used several layers of 1/8″ or so strips and a crazy system of articulated braces with crutch tips to hold the angles while the epoxy kicked).

Then use silicon bronze or nice plated oval head screws to install your teak, teak plywood, ash, or southern long leaf yellow pine ceiling strips in place.

Looks nice, feels nice. You can put insulating foam board in also. But as an added bonus, it prevents the oilcanning if the forward hull.

And congrats and welcome, etc.

Adam Silverstein
-iPhone

(last against the wall when the revolution comes)

On Dec 19, 2010, at 8:26 PM, “jamesminge” wrote:

I bought a 1980 424 in August and am doing extensive renovations to most systems. I have stripped the wallpaper and foam from the hull in the forward cabin. Hull seems pretty darn thin. should i reinforce the area of the hull between the shelving and the v berth? I plan to do some offshore sailing. Previous owners stayed mainly in shallow inland waters in New Orleans area. How would you go about reinforcing the hull? Mat, then 1/4″ balsa, then mat, then woven roving? How expensive/time consuming will this be? Is it necessary? What else, if anything need do to the hull to sail in the windwards and around the Caribbean? Thanks from Jim in New Orleans

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Check out this thread:
https://www.pearson424.org/bb2forum/viewtopic.php?t=139 Has all the details
you want.

-p
—
s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.com

On Sun, Dec 19, 2010 at 5:26 PM, jamesminge wrote:

I bought a 1980 424 in August and am doing extensive renovations to most
systems. I have stripped the wallpaper and foam from the hull in the
forward cabin. Hull seems pretty darn thin. should i reinforce the area of
the hull between the shelving and the v berth? I plan to do some offshore
sailing. Previous owners stayed mainly in shallow inland waters in New
Orleans area. How would you go about reinforcing the hull? Mat, then 1/4″
balsa, then mat, then woven roving? How expensive/time consuming will this
be? Is it necessary? What else, if anything need do to the hull to sail in
the windwards and around the Caribbean? Thanks from Jim in New Orleans

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James,
There are really two problems up forward, the flat forward section can
oil-can and the tabbing to the forward bulkheads may separate. There are a
number of way to fix this. You can lay in some kind of ribs such as
half-tube pipes of PVC or wood battens covered with glass or you can lay in
several layers of fiberglass. A little oil-canning looks scary, but isn’t
all that dangerous. Having the bulkheads break free is a diffent story. I
read a report regarding a Pearson 53 that was lost in the gulf stream about
15 years ago because her bulkheads broke free but I couldn’t find a
reference link to attach here.

Glassing in a frame will probably be stronger than just laying in more
glass, but there could be more labor and therefore it may be more expensive.
Glassing in wood battens would make it easy to put wood strips in to cover
the work. Laying in additional glass with no battens would work but you’ll
need to lay in several layers to build up some thickness. The guy I hired
added in layers of glass, as much as 3/4 inch. No matter which way you go,
overlap the work where the bulkhead tabbing is and I suggest laying the
glass over more area of the shelf and forward bunk than the little bit
Pearson put in there.

This kind of job is better hired out unless you know what you are doing.
Grinding the inside is no fun and fumes from the epoxy will rot your brain
unless you have the right gear. Figure about 30 hours of labor plus
materials. The inside surface must be ground down to expose a rough surface
or else the secondary bond won’t work. If you go with battens, they must be
attached firmly before laying in the glasswork. This is usually done by
setting wooden crosspieces in there to hold them firmly against the hull
until the epoxy sets.

Regards
Rich

Jim
Its mostly the horizontal bunk and the shelves above; how they attach to the
hull and forward and aft bulkheads. If you keep them attached, the bow
should hold together.

They guy I hired originally proposed glassing in PVC tubing. Since I was on
a tight budget and time constraint at the time he glassed in mat sections of
3/8 thickness by 24″ wide. Each section overlaps to make 3/4″ solid glass
at the overlap. Others laid in wood battens and can comment on how their
job was done. I think the wood battens might work better because they
provide an attachment for horizontal wood strips. Its probably another day
of labor but a little less material.

Rich

Hi James,
Patrick and I completed the wood battens and glassed in additional balsa
project last spring on Deep Playa. I am going to complete a write up on it
shortly and would be happy to share it.
Thanks
Dawn
s/v Deep Playa

On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 10:00 AM, wrote:

Jim,

If you have her e-mail you others who may be lurking won’t be able to learn what
you learn.

lee

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Don’t worry we’ll put it on our blog so all can see….

Thanks,
-p
—
s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.com

On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 12:24 PM, jamesminge wrote:

Hadn’t thought of that. Sorry. If it comes to me by e mail it I will post
it here. Jim

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Adam referenced a bunch of articulated braces with crutch ends…holding the braces in place while the epoxy kicks.

I put in vertical 1/2 inch wood battens glassed over for braces. You get the fiberglass tube for strength, and you get the wood to strenghten the tubes and provide tooth for the screws that will hold your ceiling strips in place.

Best of all, to hold the vertical battens whil the epoxy kicks use a HOT GLUE GUN on a 2 inch segement in the middle, and butter the rest with your epoxy. Hold for 60 seconds by hand, and the hot glue will hold it till it sets.

I like the rib approach to solving this problem. Glassed in 3/4″ vertical ribs. These then also provide mounting place for horizontal ash battens for the pretty finish

Pete

On Feb 19, 2011, at 5:21 PM, “jamesminge” wrote:

Our local (New Orleans) fiberglass guru came up with a solution (I hope) to possible oil-canning in the bows for less than $1000. He glassed in on each side of the hull between the V berth and the bookshelf, a horizontal section of 3/8″ balsa, roughly 9″ x 78″, layering mat, then mat and bidirectional woven roving. He opined that anything more would be overkill. Sure hope he’s right. It was much less expensive than other solutions proposed by local yards. Comments? Jim

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Hi Jim
I am getting ready to do much the same thing. But going to try 3 ribs of 1″ fiberglass pultrusion spaced 7 inches apart running length of the v below the bookshelf. Then a layer of quadaxial glass. May back down to just 2 ribs.
Will test it on the Marblehead to Halifax race in July.

Eric Lorentzon
EFI Sales Development Manager
412.352.1941
Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 19, 2011, at 7:21 PM, “jamesminge” wrote:

Our local (New Orleans) fiberglass guru came up with a solution (I hope) to possible oil-canning in the bows for less than $1000. He glassed in on each side of the hull between the V berth and the bookshelf, a horizontal section of 3/8″ balsa, roughly 9″ x 78″, layering mat, then mat and bidirectional woven roving. He opined that anything more would be overkill. Sure hope he’s right. It was much less expensive than other solutions proposed by local yards. Comments? Jim

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That’s pretty much what we did, and what Bill Shaw recommended. As a DIYer, I’m always a bit shocked at boat repair prices. Removing the foam backed liner ws most of the work,IMHO.
I suggest that since this job requires strong secondary bonding, ie bonding to already cured fiberglass, you confirm that they use epoxy rather than polyester resin. Also be sure that they are going to glass the shelves to the hull. As Rich pointed out, the shelves provide much reinforcement to these panels.
Quent
Clairebuoyant #132

That’s pretty much what we did, and what Bill Shaw recommended. As a DIYer, I’m always a bit shocked at boat repair prices. Removing the foam backed liner ws most of the work,IMHO.
I suggest that since this job requires strong secondary bonding, ie bonding to already cured fiberglass, you confirm that they use epoxy rather than polyester resin. Also be sure that they are going to glass the shelves to the hull. As Rich pointed out, the shelves provide much reinforcement to these panels.
Quent
Clairebuoyant #132

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This is from the now defunct Pearson Current newsletter and what I had done
on my boat.

Q: have a small yacht maintenance business in Gulfport, MS and have the
privilege of taking care of three P424s. I believe all three owners are
members of your Association. One of the owners wants us to beef up the
v-berth to prevent oil canning. I’ve read several articles in The Current on
this problem, but I am not sure if I should lay some thicker glass on the
inside of the hull or seek another solution. I know the shelves and v-berth
need reinforcing where they come in contact with the hull. It seems to me
that the hull is very thin under the shelf down to the v-berth. Any ideas
that you might have would be most helpful. *— Brian Welch
*
A: I would recommend the following between the underside of the shelf and
the top ginof the V-berth:

1. Sand the inside of the hull to remove any wax, glue, etc.

1. Apply one layer of 1.5 oz. mat in this area. Catalyze the resin for a
slow cure to keep it cool to prevent print through.

1. Before the mat cures, wet the panel of 3/8″ thick balsa with resin
that will go against the hull and apply pressure to the balsa for a good
bond. Note that you should taper all 4 edges of the balsa over a width of
2″.)

1. After this lay up has cured, apply one layer of 1.5 oz. mat and over
this one layer of 1.8 oz. woven roving. This should stiffen the area
considerably.

*– Bill Shaw*

-p
—
s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.com | @DeepPlaya

On Sat, Feb 19, 2011 at 4:21 PM, jamesminge wrote:

Our local (New Orleans) fiberglass guru came up with a solution (I hope) to
possible oil-canning in the bows for less than $1000. He glassed in on each
side of the hull between the V berth and the bookshelf, a horizontal section
of 3/8″ balsa, roughly 9″ x 78″, layering mat, then mat and bidirectional
woven roving. He opined that anything more would be overkill. Sure hope
he’s right. It was much less expensive than other solutions proposed by
local yards. Comments? Jim

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