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    • #68228
      Mark Oppe
      Participant

      does anyone have experience of fitting a direct to steering autohelm on a ketch rigged 424. I have a Navco belt to wheel driven autohelm which does not seem up to the job.

      Thanks for your help.

      Mark on Mary Murray

      Mark Oppe

    • #76663
      Mark Oppe
      Participant

      does anyone have experience of fitting a direct to steering autohelm on a ketch rigged 424. I have a Navco belt to wheel driven autohelm which does not seem up to the job.

      Thanks for your help.

      Mark on Mary Murray

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      Mark Oppe

    • #76664
      madsailor
      Moderator

      Hi Mark,

      It’s what I have on my 424. I installed it myself. Has worked flawlessly
      with the C-80, but can work with any NMEA chart plotter.

      Bob

      On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 10:21 AM, Mark Oppe wrote:

      does anyone have experience of fitting a direct to steering autohelm on a
      ketch rigged 424. I have a Navco belt to wheel driven autohelm which does
      not seem up to the job.

      Thanks for your help.

      Mark on Mary Murray

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      —
      Bob Fine
      s/v Pelican
      Pearson 424 Hull #8
      http://thesailinglife.blogspot.com
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    • #76665
      Anonymous

      Mark,

      My boat came with an Autohelm 3000 on the wheel. I wanted a wheel pilot –
      they’re cheaper, easier to install and consume less power than internal
      units – but didn’t trust the Autohelm for blue water cruising. I bought a
      spare 3000 on eBay, but then decided to just replace the Autohelm with the
      stronger, truly waterproof CPT brand unit (http://cptautopilot.com/). It’s
      pretty good, much better quality than Autohelm, but still a bit underpowered
      for a 42′ boat in a real blow. When conditions warrant, I use the CPT and my
      Auto-Helm windvane in combination, each augmenting the other, and can
      self-steer through anything.

      I still carry my two Autohelm 3000’s as spares, and also rigged a tiller
      pilot to the windvane as an instant backup. If I ever wind up hand-steering
      across an ocean it won’t be for lack of preparation.

      Tor


      SilverHeels, P-424 #17
      http://www.silverheels.us



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    • #76666
      RichCarter
      Participant

      Mark
      I put an autohelm-2000 on my boat about 26 years ago. Still works fine. Installation was straightforward. The drive mechanism has its own tiller arm and is just above the steering quadrant.

      rich


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    • #76599
      Chuck Ruble
      Participant

      Mark, I have a Raymarine type two linear drive. The unit is off for a rudder repair. It is a pretty straightforward installation, a mounting surface with a backging plate at the stern end of the stbd cockpit locker is where the foot is attached. The other end is terminated on a steering arm attached to the rudder stock. Not much more to it than that.

      Chuck

    • #76667
      Chuck Ruble
      Participant

      Mark, I have a Raymarine type two linear drive. The unit is off for a rudder repair. It is a pretty straightforward installation, a mounting surface with a backging plate at the stern end of the stbd cockpit locker is where the foot is attached. The other end is terminated on a steering arm attached to the rudder stock. Not much more to it than that.

      Chuck

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    • #76668
      madsailor
      Moderator

      There’s a little more than that – first, the full extension of the drive
      must be more than the fixed rudder stops and the adjustment at installation
      must be less than the fixed rudder stocks.

      When it’s disengaged you don’t want to be pulling or pushing the drive past
      its stops and when it’s engaged, you don’t want it slamming the fixed
      stops.

      I’ve seen more of these units destroyed in one or the other of these ways.

      Bob

      On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 1:12 PM, Chuck Ruble wrote:

      Mark, I have a Raymarine type two linear drive. The unit is off for a
      rudder repair. It is a pretty straightforward installation, a mounting
      surface with a backging plate at the stern end of the stbd cockpit locker is
      where the foot is attached. The other end is terminated on a steering arm
      attached to the rudder stock. Not much more to it than that.

      Chuck

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      —
      Bob Fine
      s/v Pelican
      Pearson 424 Hull #8
      http://thesailinglife.blogspot.com
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    • #76600
      quent
      Participant

      Here’s how one owner did it on a P-424:

      http://www.oceannavigator.com/content/installing-powerful-belowdecks-autopilot

      Quent
      Clairebuoyant, #132

    • #76669
      quent
      Participant

      Here’s how one owner did it on a P-424:

      http://www.oceannavigator.com/content/installing-powerful-belowdecks-autopilot

      Quent
      Clairebuoyant, #132

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    • #76670
      john stevenson
      Participant

      Mark,
      Replacing the wheel Autohelm with a 6000+ below decks autopilot was probably
      the first major upgrade I did to Sarah in 2000. It’s still going strong,
      but I did replace the course computer in 2006. I believe the original
      computer failed due to my SSB installation. Wiring for the SSB ran too
      close to the old computer. No problems with this setup since 2006.
      I let the boatyard munchins do the installation of the drive unit in the
      starboard locker. I can get into that locker, but then I can’t move.
      Beware of DIY recommendations from some of the munchin owners on this email
      list if you are over 6′ .

      Here is a link to some pics of the installation on Sarah.
      http://www.svsarah.com/Sarah/ewUpgradeDeckRig.htm#Autopilot
      The pictures are of the drive unit are not very good as they were shot blind
      for the reason stated above.

      On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 1:49 PM, quent wrote:

      Here’s how one owner did it on a P-424:

      http://www.oceannavigator.com/content/installing-powerful-belowdecks-autopilot

      Quent
      Clairebuoyant, #132

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      —
      Regards,
      John Stevenson
      http://www.svsarah.com
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    • #76671
      john stevenson
      Participant

      There should have been a smiley face after the last sentence in the first
      paragraph, as below:

      “Beware of DIY recommendations from some of the munchin owners on this email
      list if you are over 6′ [?].”

      On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 1:59 PM, John Stevenson wrote:

      Mark,
      Replacing the wheel Autohelm with a 6000+ below decks autopilot was
      probably the first major upgrade I did to Sarah in 2000. It’s still going
      strong, but I did replace the course computer in 2006. I believe the
      original computer failed due to my SSB installation. Wiring for the SSB ran
      too close to the old computer. No problems with this setup since 2006.
      I let the boatyard munchins do the installation of the drive unit in the
      starboard locker. I can get into that locker, but then I can’t move.
      Beware of DIY recommendations from some of the munchin owners on this email
      list if you are over 6′ .

      Here is a link to some pics of the installation on Sarah.
      http://www.svsarah.com/Sarah/ewUpgradeDeckRig.htm#Autopilot
      The pictures are of the drive unit are not very good as they were shot
      blind for the reason stated above.

      On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 1:49 PM, quent wrote:

      Here’s how one owner did it on a P-424:

      http://www.oceannavigator.com/content/installing-powerful-belowdecks-autopilot

      Quent
      Clairebuoyant, #132

      _______________________________________________
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      —
      Regards,
      John Stevenson
      http://www.svsarah.com

      —
      Regards,
      John Stevenson
      http://www.svsarah.com

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    • #76672
      Hull152_Patrick
      Spectator

      Deep Playa also has an Alpha Marine Systems 3000
      http://www.alphamarinesystems.com/sales_3000.htm

      It’s a bit antiquated
      looking, but we use it a lot when we’re motoring in the frugal summer winds
      in Puget Sound and it works fine. The drive unit are mounted on a very
      sturdy beam in the starboard side of the aft lazarette. I just spent 10
      minutes looking for a picture of that, and I don’t have one. 🙁

      Anyway, seems solid, have no plans to replace it.
      -p

      —
      s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.com

      On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 7:21 AM, Mark Oppe wrote:

      does anyone have experience of fitting a direct to steering autohelm on a
      ketch rigged 424. I have a Navco belt to wheel driven autohelm which does
      not seem up to the job.

      Thanks for your help.

      Mark on Mary Murray

      _______________________________________________
      maillist mailing list

      https://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org

      _______________________________________________
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      Owners no more...
      Thanks Dawn and Patrick!

    • #76673
      petedd
      Participant

      Tor,

      I also have the Autohelm and CPT combination. I have never used the two
      in tandem. How does that work? How do you keep them from fighting each
      other?

      Pete

      On 1/24/2011 9:25 AM, Silverheels wrote:

      Quote:
      Mark,

      My boat came with an Autohelm 3000 on the wheel. I wanted a wheel pilot –
      they’re cheaper, easier to install and consume less power than internal
      units – but didn’t trust the Autohelm for blue water cruising. I bought a
      spare 3000 on eBay, but then decided to just replace the Autohelm with the
      stronger, truly waterproof CPT brand unit (http://cptautopilot.com/). It’s
      pretty good, much better quality than Autohelm, but still a bit underpowered
      for a 42′ boat in a real blow. When conditions warrant, I use the CPT and my
      Auto-Helm windvane in combination, each augmenting the other, and can
      self-steer through anything.

      I still carry my two Autohelm 3000’s as spares, and also rigged a tiller
      pilot to the windvane as an instant backup. If I ever wind up hand-steering
      across an ocean it won’t be for lack of preparation.

      Tor


      SilverHeels, P-424 #17
      http://www.silverheels.us



      Original Message


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    • #76674
      john stevenson
      Participant

      Patrick,
      I think this is the picture you are looking for. Got it from Jack a few
      years ago.

      On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 3:24 PM, Pete Dubler wrote:

      Quote:
      Tor,

      I also have the Autohelm and CPT combination. I have never used the two in
      tandem. How does that work? How do you keep them from fighting each other?

      Pete

      On 1/24/2011 9:25 AM, Silverheels wrote:

      Quote:
      Mark,

      My boat came with an Autohelm 3000 on the wheel. I wanted a wheel pilot –
      they’re cheaper, easier to install and consume less power than internal
      units – but didn’t trust the Autohelm for blue water cruising. I bought a
      spare 3000 on eBay, but then decided to just replace the Autohelm with the
      stronger, truly waterproof CPT brand unit (http://cptautopilot.com/).
      It’s
      pretty good, much better quality than Autohelm, but still a bit
      underpowered
      for a 42′ boat in a real blow. When conditions warrant, I use the CPT and
      my
      Auto-Helm windvane in combination, each augmenting the other, and can
      self-steer through anything.

      I still carry my two Autohelm 3000’s as spares, and also rigged a tiller
      pilot to the windvane as an instant backup. If I ever wind up
      hand-steering
      across an ocean it won’t be for lack of preparation.

      Tor


      SilverHeels, P-424 #17
      http://www.silverheels.us



      Original Message


      Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum

    • #76675
      unabated
      Participant

      One of the best things I found for using the Octopus hydraulic cylinder and pump is that the entire unit is repairable at sea with common tools by the common person. Most of the other units require that they be sent in to be repaired. (Raymaine uses a small nylon pinion gear in their drive that is only factory  repairable)
      http://www.octopusmarine.ca/content/products-and-services/linear-actuators.htm
      The other thing which is probably a function of both the pump/cylinder and the control head is the SPEED lock to lock to be able to control the both fast enough in large ocean swells on the bean and aft.
      For the control head I use the Raymarine X30 control head.
      Been very happy with both.  Norfolk to Bermuda, Bermuda to ST Maartin etc……
      Alan

      — On Mon, 1/24/11, John Stevenson wrote:

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    • #76678
      Anonymous

      Hi Pete,

      Sorry if I wasn’t clear about what I’m using. I have a CPT electric wheel
      pilot and an Auto-Helm brand windvane made by Scanmar Marine, the same
      factory that makes the Monitor windvane. The Auto-Helm brand windvane is no
      relation to Autohelm brand autopilots. (The two Autohelm 3000’s I have are
      in a locker, emergency back-up units if the CPT breaks.)

      As for keeping the autopilot and the windvane from fighting each other, I
      suppose the trick is to let them, but just marginally:

      The boat develops weather helm in strong winds. Of course, I first trim out
      as much of that as possible with the sails, but sometimes that’s not enough,
      or sometimes I just want to fly canvas to keep the boat moving fast. If the
      windvane is steering more radically than I want, as it may in fluky winds
      and/or compound seas, I switch on the wheel pilot to help hold a tighter
      course. If the CPT autopilot is fighting a lot of weather helm, I set the
      windvane to steer a tad farther off the wind than the autopilot setting.
      That takes the strain off the autopilot, which easily compensates for slight
      the windvane-created lee helm. Once I’ve got the right balance, the CPT is
      just barely working to make small course adjustments using minimal
      electricity. The Auto-Helm’s big steering rudder does all the hard work of
      balancing out the weather helm and compensating for large waves, the power
      coming from the passing water rather than from the battery bank. I can
      usually achieve this balance in 10 or 20 seconds now that I’m used to doing
      it. Each unit relieves the workload on the other. Together they steer easily
      and accurately.

      I realize most owners have an internal autopilot. I have no issue with
      those, other than their high initial cost and relatively big amperage draw
      under sails. There is no question they are stronger than any wheel pilot,
      and can often function perfectly for years. What I do take issue with is
      relying on only one form of self-steering aboard a boat making long passages
      or even just going cruising, especially when sailed by a couple or a
      single-hander. That’s just asking for trouble. It’s going to break
      eventually, and if Murphy has anything to do with it it’ll break a thousand
      miles from nowhere. For me an optimum self-steering set-up for cruising
      includes a primary autopilot (with a complete set of spare parts or else a
      complete spare unit), a windvane (with spare parts), and at least one tiller
      pilot ready to connect to the windvane. A bare minimum is 2 complete
      autopilots.

      IMHO,

      Tor


      SilverHeels, P-424 #17
      http://www.silverheels.us



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    • #76679
      petedd
      Participant

      Tor,

      Sorry, I forgot that your Auto-Helm is your windvane. I know you have
      mentioned that before and quite recently in fact.

      Good sailing,

      Pete

      On 1/24/2011 8:40 PM, Silverheels wrote:

      Quote:
      Hi Pete,

      Sorry if I wasn’t clear about what I’m using. I have a CPT electric wheel
      pilot and an Auto-Helm brand windvane made by Scanmar Marine, the same
      factory that makes the Monitor windvane. The Auto-Helm brand windvane is no
      relation to Autohelm brand autopilots. (The two Autohelm 3000’s I have are
      in a locker, emergency back-up units if the CPT breaks.)

      As for keeping the autopilot and the windvane from fighting each other, I
      suppose the trick is to let them, but just marginally:

      The boat develops weather helm in strong winds. Of course, I first trim out
      as much of that as possible with the sails, but sometimes that’s not enough,
      or sometimes I just want to fly canvas to keep the boat moving fast. If the
      windvane is steering more radically than I want, as it may in fluky winds
      and/or compound seas, I switch on the wheel pilot to help hold a tighter
      course. If the CPT autopilot is fighting a lot of weather helm, I set the
      windvane to steer a tad farther off the wind than the autopilot setting.
      That takes the strain off the autopilot, which easily compensates for slight
      the windvane-created lee helm. Once I’ve got the right balance, the CPT is
      just barely working to make small course adjustments using minimal
      electricity. The Auto-Helm’s big steering rudder does all the hard work of
      balancing out the weather helm and compensating for large waves, the power
      coming from the passing water rather than from the battery bank. I can
      usually achieve this balance in 10 or 20 seconds now that I’m used to doing
      it. Each unit relieves the workload on the other. Together they steer easily
      and accurately.

      I realize most owners have an internal autopilot. I have no issue with
      those, other than their high initial cost and relatively big amperage draw
      under sails. There is no question they are stronger than any wheel pilot,
      and can often function perfectly for years. What I do take issue with is
      relying on only one form of self-steering aboard a boat making long passages
      or even just going cruising, especially when sailed by a couple or a
      single-hander. That’s just asking for trouble. It’s going to break
      eventually, and if Murphy has anything to do with it it’ll break a thousand
      miles from nowhere. For me an optimum self-steering set-up for cruising
      includes a primary autopilot (with a complete set of spare parts or else a
      complete spare unit), a windvane (with spare parts), and at least one tiller
      pilot ready to connect to the windvane. A bare minimum is 2 complete
      autopilots.

      IMHO,

      Tor


      SilverHeels, P-424 #17
      http://www.silverheels.us



      Original Message


      Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum

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