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Bob,
I gather some transmissions can handle a free-wheeling prop under sail while
others are damaged by it, presumably because the transmission oil isn’t
circulating adequately when the engine is off. Some transmissions lock when
you put them in gear. I wish mine did! When my prop free-wheeled, as it did
when I bought this boat, the noise spoiled the sailing ambience for me. So I
installed a Shaft-Lok. I’ve had my share of problems with it, but when it’s
working it’s great.Tor
Silverheels, P-424 #17
<.. snip>
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Hi Tor,
I use the spinning shaft for power – over about 5 knots, I get more than
enough power run the autopilot, instruments, and refrigerator. So I like
that – it only takes about half a knot off the speed and it keeps the
batteries charged.There are, apparently, three different transmissions used on the 424s,
mine, one that locks (I think a Hurth), and another that’s not supposed to
freewheel. If yours was freewheeling when you got the boat I have to
believe it’s ok – you have one like mine. Locking it is optional.I may very well be wrong here, but it seems to me a big three bladed prop
dragging through the water locked creates more drag than one spinning with
no load (I know there’s a load with the alternator – at full speed, it’s
about 16hp). I’m sure there’s some kind of study on this.Anyway, there’ve been discussions about this before.
Bob
On Tue, Mar 26, 2013 at 3:29 PM, Silverheels wrote:
Quote:Bob,I gather some transmissions can handle a free-wheeling prop under sail
while
others are damaged by it, presumably because the transmission oil isn’t
circulating adequately when the engine is off. Some transmissions lock when
you put them in gear. I wish mine did! When my prop free-wheeled, as it did
when I bought this boat, the noise spoiled the sailing ambience for me. So
I
installed a Shaft-Lok. I’ve had my share of problems with it, but when it’s
working it’s great.Tor
Silverheels, P-424 #17
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Actually, my Paragon transmission self-destructed soon after I bought the
boat, requiring a complete rebuilt by a specialty shop here. So maybe
freewheeling wasn’t OK for it. (Or maybe it was because the PO never changed
the fluid. Or both.)Tor
Silverheels, P-424 #17
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I think that’s what I have and it’s gone 10000 miles that way. It may be
lack of maintenance.Bob
On Tue, Mar 26, 2013 at 4:45 PM, Silverheels wrote:
Quote:Actually, my Paragon transmission self-destructed soon after I bought the
boat, requiring a complete rebuilt by a specialty shop here. So maybe
freewheeling wasn’t OK for it. (Or maybe it was because the PO never
changed
the fluid. Or both.)Tor
Silverheels, P-424 #17
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Those boats that a Warner velvet drive transmission had a prop lock installed. The Warner transmission should not free wheel as there is no lubrication when the engine is not runnning.
The original Proplock was hydraulicly deactivated by transmission oil pressure. This has worked fine. However the company that made it is very long out business.
I have been able to fabricate my own break pads as the old ones wore out. Recently the bronze casting began to fail. I installed a reconditioned feathering Max Prop to avoid free wheeling. It has worked. -
Lee,
Your statement about the Velvet Drive tranny is inconsistent with what the
Velvet Drive tech reps have told me. Until engine starts to turn the gears
in the tranny are not engaged and do not turn. The only thing turning is
the output spline, none of the internal parts are turning.
Anyway that’s what I have been told on repeated inquiries to mechanics and
tech reps familiar with the Velvet Drive.Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.comOn Sun, Mar 31, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Bead Game wrote:
Those boats that a Warner velvet drive transmission had a prop lock
installed. The Warner transmission should not free wheel as there is no
lubrication when the engine is not runnning.
The original Proplock was hydraulicly deactivated by transmission oil
pressure. This has worked fine. However the company that made it is very
long out business.
I have been able to fabricate my own break pads as the old ones wore
out. Recently the bronze casting began to fail. I installed a
reconditioned feathering Max Prop to avoid free wheeling. It has worked.
Lee Hirsch
Out of da Bronx_______________________________________________
maillist mailing listhttps://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org
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I must admit there has been a lot of inconsistent information on the
subject of free-wheeling Velvet Drives. I wonder if that inconsistency is
because the vast majority of installed VDs have a reduction gear. That
reduction gear may be turned by the free-wheeling prop and could be
damaged. As far as I know all 424s have a direct drive VD with the
reduction gear in the V-Drive. That was the context of my discussion with
the VD experts.Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.comOn Sun, Mar 31, 2013 at 11:34 AM, John Stevenson
wrote:Lee,
Your statement about the Velvet Drive tranny is inconsistent with what the
Velvet Drive tech reps have told me. Until engine starts to turn the gears
in the tranny are not engaged and do not turn. The only thing turning is
the output spline, none of the internal parts are turning.
Anyway that’s what I have been told on repeated inquiries to mechanics and
tech reps familiar with the Velvet Drive.Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.comOn Sun, Mar 31, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Bead Game wrote:
Those boats that a Warner velvet drive transmission had a prop lock
installed. The Warner transmission should not free wheel as there is no
lubrication when the engine is not runnning.
The original Proplock was hydraulicly deactivated by transmission oil
pressure. This has worked fine. However the company that made it is very
long out business.
I have been able to fabricate my own break pads as the old ones wore
out. Recently the bronze casting began to fail. I installed a
reconditioned feathering Max Prop to avoid free wheeling. It has worked.
Lee Hirsch
Out of da Bronx_______________________________________________
maillist mailing listhttps://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org
_______________________________________________
maillist mailing listhttps://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org
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I’ve been through the manuals for all three transmissions. Velvet drive
can freewheel in neutral, should not be left in gear. Paragon needs to be
locked either through a brake (that’s the transmission the 424 came with a
brake for) or folding/feathering prop. Doesn’t self lubricate. And the
Hurth which can rotate or be locked in reverse. The reverse lock is the
preferred method.On Sun, Mar 31, 2013 at 11:47 AM, John Stevenson
wrote:I must admit there has been a lot of inconsistent information on the
subject of free-wheeling Velvet Drives. I wonder if that inconsistency is
because the vast majority of installed VDs have a reduction gear. That
reduction gear may be turned by the free-wheeling prop and could be
damaged. As far as I know all 424s have a direct drive VD with the
reduction gear in the V-Drive. That was the context of my discussion with
the VD experts.Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.comOn Sun, Mar 31, 2013 at 11:34 AM, John Stevenson
wrote:Lee,
Your statement about the Velvet Drive tranny is inconsistent with whatthe
Velvet Drive tech reps have told me. Until engine starts to turn the
gears
in the tranny are not engaged and do not turn. The only thing turning is
the output spline, none of the internal parts are turning.
Anyway that’s what I have been told on repeated inquiries to mechanicsand
tech reps familiar with the Velvet Drive.
Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.comOn Sun, Mar 31, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Bead Game
wrote:
Those boats that a Warner velvet drive transmission had a prop lock
installed. The Warner transmission should not free wheel as there is no
lubrication when the engine is not runnning.
The original Proplock was hydraulicly deactivated by transmission oil
pressure. This has worked fine. However the company that made it is very
long out business.
I have been able to fabricate my own break pads as the old ones wore
out. Recently the bronze casting began to fail. I installed a
reconditioned feathering Max Prop to avoid free wheeling. It has worked.
Lee Hirsch
Out of da Bronx_______________________________________________
maillist mailing listhttps://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org
_______________________________________________
maillist mailing listhttps://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org
—
Bob Fine
s/v Pelican
Pearson 424 Hull #8
http://thesailinglife.blogspot.com
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