Going Electric

[Anonymous]

I’ve taken the decision to switch #18 from diesel to electric. 

I pulled the W58, the v-drive and the fuel tank this weekend. And the head, but that’s another story… The feeling when the old hunk of iron swung off the boat – knowing that this is the last time I will ever have diesel in the bilge and an internal combustion engine in my living space! My boat is pretty filthy in general, and this will go a long way to helping me solve that issue. 

I’m planning on the battery bank and additional storage back there. I’m doing a few things in preparation for the process, most notably spending several days making access hatches and storage locations in the sole.

I had a few things to cut off the engine to get it completely out at the angle we were working. It’s useful to take the engine feet off (I had some anti-vibration ones which compounded the fit issue).

I know at least two other owners who are taking this step, and I’m looking forward to reporting back to all of you on progress.
– 
Ewan O’Leary
Agile Coach
Find Your Purpose
+1.617.300.0665
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[Anonymous]

Can I have the engine? I want to make my boat twin prop…
On Jun 1, 2015 4:36 PM, “Ewan O’Leary via maillist”
wrote:

I’ve taken the decision to switch #18 from diesel to electric.

I pulled the W58, the v-drive and the fuel tank this weekend. And the
head, but that’s another story… The feeling when the old hunk of iron
swung off the boat – knowing that this is the last time I will ever have
diesel in the bilge and an internal combustion engine in my living space!
My boat is pretty filthy in general, and this will go a long way to helping
me solve that issue.

I’m planning on the battery bank and additional storage back there. I’m
doing a few things in preparation for the process, most notably spending
several days making access hatches and storage locations in the sole.

I had a few things to cut off the engine to get it completely out at the
angle we were working. It’s useful to take the engine feet off (I had some
anti-vibration ones which compounded the fit issue).

I know at least two other owners who are taking this step, and I’m looking
forward to reporting back to all of you on progress.
—
Ewan O’Leary
Agile Coach
Find Your Purpose
+1.617.300.0665
_______________________________________________
maillist mailing list

https://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org

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[Anonymous]

Hi Ewan,
Have you picked the system you’re going with?   I looked into electric and only recently found a system that offered what I considered sufficient power.   For now I will have to stick with diesel since I don’t see a reasonable option to give sufficient range under power for my cruising plans.
Skip

 

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[Anonymous]

LOL! As long as you use a bicycle or a Tesla to come and get it from the scrap yard, you’re welcome to it. 

e
On June 1, 2015 at 2:20:41 PM, Robert Fine via maillist () wrote:

Can I have the engine? I want to make my boat twin prop…
On Jun 1, 2015 4:36 PM, “Ewan O’Leary via maillist”
wrote:

I’ve taken the decision to switch #18 from diesel to electric.

I pulled the W58, the v-drive and the fuel tank this weekend. And the
head, but that’s another story… The feeling when the old hunk of iron
swung off the boat – knowing that this is the last time I will ever have
diesel in the bilge and an internal combustion engine in my living space!
My boat is pretty filthy in general, and this will go a long way to helping
me solve that issue.

I’m planning on the battery bank and additional storage back there. I’m
doing a few things in preparation for the process, most notably spending
several days making access hatches and storage locations in the sole.

I had a few things to cut off the engine to get it completely out at the
angle we were working. It’s useful to take the engine feet off (I had some
anti-vibration ones which compounded the fit issue).

I know at least two other owners who are taking this step, and I’m looking
forward to reporting back to all of you on progress.
—
Ewan O’Leary
Agile Coach
Find Your Purpose
+1.617.300.0665
_______________________________________________
maillist mailing list

https://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org

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[Anonymous]

Skip,

Great question. I’ve decided on the QuietTorque LC25 or the regular 20kW version. I’m trying to mount it in the v-drive location but I’ll have to do some fiberglass work to get it aligned right. 

Range is always difficult – I’m planning on carrying a gas generator with me, and running solar, wind and regeneration to keep charge up. I will have plenty of space in the stern for batteries, but am bound to have a few experiments to run to make sure I’ve got a proper sense of where I’ll be, nm-wise. 

I’m looking at the carbon-foam AGM batteries Bruce Schwab is representing (http://www.bruceschwab.com) and I’m working with Mike Gunning at electricyachtsocal.com on the design.

Ewan

On June 1, 2015 at 2:45:59 PM, Skip MacElhannon () wrote:

Hi Ewan,

Have you picked the system you’re going with?   I looked into electric and only recently found a system that offered what I considered sufficient power.   For now I will have to stick with diesel since I don’t see a reasonable option to give sufficient range under power for my cruising plans.

Skip

 

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[Anonymous]

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Start of attached email. Subject: Re: Going Electric

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Are you planning on selling any parts from old engine??
Alan

Sent from my iPhone

On Jun 1, 2015, at 6:04 PM, Ewan O’Leary via maillist wrote:

LOL! As long as you use a bicycle or a Tesla to come and get it from the scrap yard, you’re welcome to it.

e
On June 1, 2015 at 2:20:41 PM, Robert Fine via maillist () wrote:

Can I have the engine? I want to make my boat twin prop…
On Jun 1, 2015 4:36 PM, “Ewan O’Leary via maillist”
wrote:

I’ve taken the decision to switch #18 from diesel to electric.

I pulled the W58, the v-drive and the fuel tank this weekend. And the
head, but that’s another story… The feeling when the old hunk of iron
swung off the boat – knowing that this is the last time I will ever have
diesel in the bilge and an internal combustion engine in my living space!
My boat is pretty filthy in general, and this will go a long way to helping
me solve that issue.

I’m planning on the battery bank and additional storage back there. I’m
doing a few things in preparation for the process, most notably spending
several days making access hatches and storage locations in the sole.

I had a few things to cut off the engine to get it completely out at the
angle we were working. It’s useful to take the engine feet off (I had some
anti-vibration ones which compounded the fit issue).

I know at least two other owners who are taking this step, and I’m looking
forward to reporting back to all of you on progress.
—
Ewan O’Leary
Agile Coach
Find Your Purpose
+1.617.300.0665
_______________________________________________
maillist mailing list

https://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org

_______________________________________________
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https://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org
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[Anonymous]

 
Unfortunately, it was submerged and it is seized, so its off to the scrap heap. If there is anything left, I’ll let you have it for shipping and goodwill only. I have a ton of spares – I’ll put together an inventory and post here.

Ewan

On June 1, 2015 at 5:04:20 PM, aphil138— via maillist ((mailto:)) wrote:

Are you planning on selling any parts from old engine??
Alan

Sent from my iPhone

On Jun 1, 2015, at 6:04 PM, Ewan O’Leary via maillist wrote:

LOL! As long as you use a bicycle or a Tesla to come and get it from the scrap yard, you’re welcome to it.

e
On June 1, 2015 at 2:20:41 PM, Robert Fine via maillist () wrote:

Can I have the engine? I want to make my boat twin prop…
On Jun 1, 2015 4:36 PM, “Ewan O’Leary via maillist”
wrote:

I’ve taken the decision to switch #18 from diesel to electric.

I pulled the W58, the v-drive and the fuel tank this weekend. And the
head, but that’s another story… The feeling when the old hunk of iron
swung off the boat – knowing that this is the last time I will ever have
diesel in the bilge and an internal combustion engine in my living space!
My boat is pretty filthy in general, and this will go a long way to helping
me solve that issue.

I’m planning on the battery bank and additional storage back there. I’m
doing a few things in preparation for the process, most notably spending
several days making access hatches and storage locations in the sole.

I had a few things to cut off the engine to get it completely out at the
angle we were working. It’s useful to take the engine feet off (I had some
anti-vibration ones which compounded the fit issue).

I know at least two other owners who are taking this step, and I’m looking
forward to reporting back to all of you on progress.
—
Ewan O’Leary
Agile Coach
Find Your Purpose
+1.617.300.0665
_______________________________________________
maillist mailing list

https://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org

_______________________________________________
maillist mailing list

https://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org
_______________________________________________
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https://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org

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[Anonymous]

I looked at this option a few years back when I repowered. The technology just wasn’t there. By now, there may be electric drive units of sufficient power, but battery capacity still isn’t there. I had always thought I’d be replacing the drive engine with a similar capacity diesel generator. Rather than the V-drive and linkage from the engine, I assumed I’d have an electric motor down there with cables to the generator. Two advantages come to mind. Now that I have a real generator, I can power things like air conditioning. The main benefit would be the removal of that piece of junk under the cabin sole. I’d have to run the engine at a specific speed (e.g. 3600 RPM) for the AC power to be used onboard unless I had a huge inverter. Things get complicated for a single owner to solve. What we need is a solution from a marine engine manufacturer.

Here’s a link to something similar.

http://regennautic.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Motor-Boating-Hybrid-Feature1.pdf

Rich

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[Anonymous]

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Start of attached email. Subject: Re: Going Electric

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How do you generate hot water from an electric engine?
Norris Larson
 

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[Anonymous]

With the solution below, you still have a diesel onboard. It isn’t connected directly to the prop-shaft but it is otherwise similar to what you have. If you just go with batteries, I guess you use a solar shower and hope for sunshine.

If you expect to power with just batteries. think again. Let’s do the math. Assuming you run your engine at a moderate speed, you’re probably using about 25KW. With a fuel consumption of 1 gal/hr and a 70 gal tank, that’s 1875 KWH.

If you want to replace that with batteries, let’s assume you use 6V 220AH golf-cart pairs. Each pair provides 2.64KWH. You’ll need a bank of 710 pairs. At 120lbs/pr, that’s over 8500 pounds. Assuming you can find room to stow them, good luck carting them to your boat. You’ll certainly need a shower after stowing them.

Lets assume you just want to use the engine to get in and out of the harbor, say 30 minutes in and 30 minutes back. You think you can charge them with solar panels and avoid a generator. That’s 25KWH. You could get by with about 10 pairs, but a 10A solar array will take over 200 hrs to charge it back up.

Rich

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[Anonymous]

 
Rich,

Technology has moved forward quite a ways since you repowered. There are a few repowers documented online at electricyachtsocal.com that might be of interest to the group, including one or two heavy cruising boats, and several hybrid setups. 

I’m planning on using Firefly AGM batteries. They have a pretty interesting approach which you can read about here.

http://www.bruceschwab.com/uploads/2014-firefly-handout2.pdf

Also, a good endorsement from Nigel Calder:

http://www.bruceschwab.com/uploads/firefly-testimonial-nigel.pdf 

As an aside: I am not endorsing these batteries. Rather, I am sharing my plans and soon my experiences as I move forward with the project. I thought I should point out also that I’m not getting paid by any vendor, so my bruises and scrapes will be genuine!

Ewan

—

On June 2, 2015 at 12:58:26 PM, ((mailto:)) wrote:

Quote:

I looked at this option a few years back when I repowered. The technology just wasn’t there. By now, there may be electric drive units of sufficient power, but battery capacity still isn’t there. I had always thought I’d be replacing the drive engine with a similar capacity diesel generator. Rather than the V-drive and linkage from the engine, I assumed I’d have an electric motor down there with cables to the generator. Two advantages come to mind. Now that I have a real generator, I can power things like air conditioning. The main benefit would be the removal of that piece of junk under the cabin sole. I’d have to run the engine at a specific speed (e.g. 3600 RPM) for the AC power to be used onboard unless I had a huge inverter. Things get complicated for a single owner to solve. What we need is a solution from a marine engine manufacturer.

Here’s a link to something similar.

http://regennautic.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Motor-Boating-Hybrid-Feature1.pdf

Rich

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Original Message

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[Anonymous]

Hi Rich,
Went through the same process and came to the same conclusion and made the same decision.   For now, the technology just isn’t there to give you the same performance, range and simplicity with electric as with a diesel ICE. 
Yes it can be done but with off the shelf systems I’ve seen it would cost triple what a new engine, transmission and v-drive would cost.  This is if you add the cost of a large AC generator to give you the cruising range you cannot get with current battery technology.   If you just need power to get from the dock to the channel then electric/battery would do the job.  If you need a couple hundred miles range under power then it can be done but at a cost.
Also, until recently, I was not able to find a marine electric drive system that gave power equivalent to the +/- 60 HP usually installed on the 424.   In the last year I have seen some larger marine electric systems, up to 30-40 kW (60 HP is more or less 45 kW) but they list for many thousands, at least all I have ever found.   However I can buy a 40 kW, continuous duty rated industrial electric motor for around $1000-$1200 and the 68 HP electric motor in my wife’s Prius is $650 and I have heard of no motor failure problems with these units.  
I know that “marine” costs more but for that difference I could buy 5-6 industrial motors for the price of one marine unit.   Keep several and replace it every year or so.
 

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[Anonymous]

Hey, Skip, I am interested spares as well, all kidding aside.

Bob
On Jun 2, 2015 5:16 PM, “Skip MacElhannon via maillist” <
> wrote:

Quote:

Hi Rich,
Went through the same process and came to the same conclusion and made the
same decision. For now, the technology just isn’t there to give you the
same performance, range and simplicity with electric as with a diesel ICE.
Yes it can be done but with off the shelf systems I’ve seen it would cost
triple what a new engine, transmission and v-drive would cost. This is if
you add the cost of a large AC generator to give you the cruising range you
cannot get with current battery technology. If you just need power to get
from the dock to the channel then electric/battery would do the job. If
you need a couple hundred miles range under power then it can be done but
at a cost.
Also, until recently, I was not able to find a marine electric drive
system that gave power equivalent to the +/- 60 HP usually installed on the
424. In the last year I have seen some larger marine electric systems, up
to 30-40 kW (60 HP is more or less 45 kW) but they list for many thousands,
at least all I have ever found. However I can buy a 40 kW, continuous
duty rated industrial electric motor for around $1000-$1200 and the 68 HP
electric motor in my wife’s Prius is $650 and I have heard of no motor
failure problems with these units.
I know that “marine” costs more but for that difference I could buy 5-6
industrial motors for the price of one marine unit. Keep several and
replace it every year or so.

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[Anonymous]

Well as soon as I win the lottery I will probably repower with something.  Might even go electric.   If/when I do I’ll put you at the top of the list.

 

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