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Much excitement unstepping masts yesterday. Pretty good crew at DiMeglios in Mill Basin (Brooklyn), an all-family operation. They did, however, make me take off the triatic, which involved free climbing the Mizzen in 25kn wind to attach a temporary stay forward and then having a friend winch me up to the masthead in a climbing harness (essentially hanging by my left n..).
Main step was original iron and showed typical corrosion and galvanic damage, as did lower 1″ of mast. Plus it yielded a couple pounds of reliable-looking potting soil. Will be replacing step, removing 1″ of spar and putting the whole thing on an inert block 1″ high. Rewire and LEDs to follow.
Mizzen was another story. Step and spar were both aluminum but were fused. The drilled weep holes were a tip off that this was not the first time the problem was addressed. Note: Hitting the mast repeatedly with a steel wrench is not advisable and does no discernible good, as I explained to one of the DiMeglios. (it was getting late and they were tired).
Turned out the step pulled straight up and out as the 5″ galvanized lag bolts (!!) and the surrounding horizontal support were both rotten. I now have to remove the frozen step and repair the soft area (or all) of the wooden support, as well as any wet deck that resulted from water incursion. I am certain there is some, but hopefully not much bad core in the cockpit, as we moisture tested three years ago when I bought her, and I’ve taken out the view port to clean out and paint the fuel tank and saw good core there.
Also, a note to distant and future POs: painted spars can hide damaged aluminum. And fixtures should always be coated with galvanic isolating goo like Tef Gel. Don’t have your name cursed by future generations.
Ketch owners be warned! The iron main step is clearly f**ktarded, but it is obvious and a known quantity. If practical, inspect the Mizzen step.
Adam Silverstein
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I switched the turnbuckle end of the triadic stay to the main masthead when
I re-rigged my boat so I would never again have to go up the mizzen to
connect/disconnect/adjust that wire. Since I have stirrup-steps up the
mainmast (only), it’s much quicker and easier to access things up there than
on the mizzen mast.Tor
SilverHeels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
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Tor, Great idea! Another item on my ‘do’ list.
At some point I have to pull/raise my mizzen for rewiring. I assume with very loose stays I should be able to rock the mizzen loose from it’s step. Anyone care to comment?
Hank S.
SHAY #80— On Sat, 10/30/10, SilverHeels wrote:
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Spray with pb blaster for 2 weeks prior.
Adam Silverstein
-iPhoneOn Oct 30, 2010, at 5:33 PM, hs wrote:
Quote:Tor, Great idea! Another item on my ‘do’ list.At some point I have to pull/raise my mizzen for rewiring. I assume with very loose stays I should be able to rock the mizzen loose from it’s step. Anyone care to comment?
Hank S.
SHAY #80— On Sat, 10/30/10, SilverHeels wrote:
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Hank,
I was luckier than many. My mizzen mast came free from the step without
damaging anything, albeit reluctantly. The crane actually lifted the boat a
bit before the mast came free. Adam’s suggestion (below) seems like a good
one. You might also have some luck heating the mast base with a torch (after
first putting some modern equivalent of asbestos around the base to protect
the fiberglass deck!) while the crane is putting tension on it, and tapping
around the base with a wood mallet. I didn’t think of that when I unstepped
my mizzen mast, but since the spar is aluminum and the step is steel the
heat might help.Tor
SilverHeels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
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Ah HA!. You may be right. It has been a few years. I know Pearson used steel
for the mainmast step in my boat because I can still see it and remember
cleaning and repainting it with state-of-the-art coatings, which have held
up perfectly. If your mizzen mast step is aluminum then heat probably
wouldn’t help, but in that case the bond may not be so severe. Let us know
how it turns out.Tor
SilverHeels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
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Tor et al,
I know that on Doris E., hull number 178 both the mizzen and main steps
are aluminum. Per chance as with many other details there were changes
made during the production run.Dave and Pat
On 10/30/10 7:40 PM, SilverHeels wrote:
Quote:Ah HA!. You may be right. It has been a few years. I know Pearson used steel
for the mainmast step in my boat because I can still see it and remember
cleaning and repainting it with state-of-the-art coatings, which have held
up perfectly. If your mizzen mast step is aluminum then heat probably
wouldn’t help, but in that case the bond may not be so severe. Let us know
how it turns out.Tor
SilverHeels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
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#175 – Aluminum mizzen step, steel mast step.
Had mine replaced when we re-did the rigging. Shot of the original:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/deepplaya/4099561969/-p
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s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.comOn Sat, Oct 30, 2010 at 8:57 PM, dave jones wrote:
Quote:Tor et al,I know that on Doris E., hull number 178 both the mizzen and main steps are
aluminum. Per chance as with many other details there were changes made
during the production run.Dave and Pat
On 10/30/10 7:40 PM, SilverHeels wrote:
Quote:Ah HA!. You may be right. It has been a few years. I know Pearson used
steel
for the mainmast step in my boat because I can still see it and remember
cleaning and repainting it with state-of-the-art coatings, which have held
up perfectly. If your mizzen mast step is aluminum then heat probably
wouldn’t help, but in that case the bond may not be so severe. Let us know
how it turns out.Tor
SilverHeels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
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Owners no more...
Thanks Dawn and Patrick! -
Well, that pretty much narrows down when Pearson switched metals for the
mainmast step, i.e., between #175 and #178. The brain cells of mine that
registered the composition of my mizzen step 4 years ago are now gone with
the wind. I don’t recall prepping and painting it as with the main, so
perhaps it is aluminum. That would make sense for an outdoor fitting. (Makes
sense for the main step in the bilge, too, but I guess Our Builder had to
figure that out for himself.)Tor
SilverHeels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
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Easyn Reach, hull #206, had a steel mast step. It corroded and caused some galvanic corrosion to the mast base. Superficial grinding and sanding was enough to repair the damage and the base was painted with Zn something or other. I replaced the steel mast step with an anodized Al step, cast as a single piece by that frim in RI that no-one deals with unless they have to. So far so good. And, it is a well known problem among surveyors, so the presence of an anodized AL step is a plu when selling the boat./
In any event it would appear that Pearson did not change its production of steps from steel to Al.
Norris LarsonPost generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
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Ah HA! The plot thickens.
Maybe #178’s PO gave her that aluminum mainmast step.
Tor
SilverHeels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
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I know that we have not changed out the mast step… and I know the po
did not – he was barely up to swapping out the cushions.. Now the
original owner – maybe but probably not – as he owned a max prop in a
box for 10 yrs, passed to the next owner and we inherited finally 15 yrs
later.This wasn’t the kind of maintenance these guys would do.
– pat
Doris E, p424 #178SilverHeels wrote, On 10/31/10 9:04 PM:
Quote:Ah HA! The plot thickens.Maybe #178’s PO gave her that aluminum mainmast step.
Tor
SilverHeels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
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Who knows? Maybe a special order when she was built?
Tor
SilverHeels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
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Draw a line all the way around, measured from the end or another
perpendicular reference and then circumscribe it with a sabre saw with
an appropriate metal-cutting blade. Do not try to crosscut it.(I have seen this done twice; once on my boat).
Pete
On 12/1/2010 3:01 PM, Adam Silverstein wrote:
Is there a trick or technique to slicing off the poxy lower inch or two of the spar? Never done it.
Adam Silverstein
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You mean the base of the mast?
You build up the step in the same amount of length you took off. Carefully.
Otherwise all the rigging goes FUBAR.
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It depends on your situation. If its pulled out, cutting a couple of inches off is pretty easy. Use a sawsall with a metal cutting blade. If the mast is in the boat and stuck in the step, you need to have the weight lifted off the base of the mast using a crane. Its difficult to get a clean and even cut in this case but do your best. I helped someone with this problem a few years back (not a Pearson, but similar). No amount of lifting would pull the mast out of his step. The crane operator pulled the boat about two feet out of the water with no sign of movement from the mast. They finally gave up and cut the base of the mast off in place. It took about 15 minutes to cut the bottom off but it was a very uneven cut.
Rich
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This might make the job easier that a sawsall since its smaller and could probably be easier to position around the mast. I’m sure it would cut aluminum with no trouble.
http://www.harborfreight.com/electric-body-saw-65766.html
harbor freight just opened a store down the road here in NH. Life gets better and better…
Rich
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In the boat, you might try this tool
http://www.harborfreight.com/3-inch-composite-air-cut-off-tool-95028.html
again, starting by drawing the line all the way around the mast. (wear
a dust mask when using this)I have one of these and use it to cut off things in places where I can’t
easily work with a saw.Pete
On 12/2/2010 7:03 AM, wrote:
Quote:This might make the job easier that a sawsall since its smaller and could probably be easier to position around the mast. I’m sure it would cut aluminum with no trouble.http://www.harborfreight.com/electric-body-saw-65766.html
harbor freight just opened a store down the road here in NH. Life gets better and better…
Rich
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IMHO, this is one of those have the yard do it things.
-p
—
s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.comOn Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 7:54 AM, Pete Dubler wrote:
Quote:In the boat, you might try this tool
http://www.harborfreight.com/3-inch-composite-air-cut-off-tool-95028.html again, starting by drawing the line all the way around the mast. (wear a
dust mask when using this)I have one of these and use it to cut off things in places where I can’t
easily work with a saw.Pete
On 12/2/2010 7:03 AM, wrote:
Quote:This might make the job easier that a sawsall since its smaller and could
probably be easier to position around the mast. I’m sure it would cut
aluminum with no trouble.http://www.harborfreight.com/electric-body-saw-65766.html
harbor freight just opened a store down the road here in NH. Life gets
better and better…Rich
Original Message
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Owners no more...
Thanks Dawn and Patrick! -
This yard tried to pull my folding cabin table through the little hole in the coachroof. They are well-meaning.
Adam Silverstein
-iPhoneOn Dec 2, 2010, at 1:48 PM, “Patrick “Peaboy” Walters” wrote:
Quote:IMHO, this is one of those have the yard do it things.-p
—
s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.comOn Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 7:54 AM, Pete Dubler wrote:
Quote:In the boat, you might try this tool
http://www.harborfreight.com/3-inch-composite-air-cut-off-tool-95028.html again, starting by drawing the line all the way around the mast. (wear a
dust mask when using this)I have one of these and use it to cut off things in places where I can’t
easily work with a saw.Pete
On 12/2/2010 7:03 AM, wrote:
Quote:This might make the job easier that a sawsall since its smaller and could
probably be easier to position around the mast. I’m sure it would cut
aluminum with no trouble.http://www.harborfreight.com/electric-body-saw-65766.html
harbor freight just opened a store down the road here in NH. Life gets
better and better…Rich
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What is a yard? ;^)
Pete
On 12/2/2010 11:48 AM, Patrick “Peaboy” Walters wrote:
Quote:IMHO, this is one of those have the yard do it things.-p
—
s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.comOn Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 7:54 AM, Pete Dubler wrote:
Quote:In the boat, you might try this tool
http://www.harborfreight.com/3-inch-composite-air-cut-off-tool-95028.html again, starting by drawing the line all the way around the mast. (wear a
dust mask when using this)I have one of these and use it to cut off things in places where I can’t
easily work with a saw.Pete
On 12/2/2010 7:03 AM, wrote:
Quote:This might make the job easier that a sawsall since its smaller and could
probably be easier to position around the mast. I’m sure it would cut
aluminum with no trouble.http://www.harborfreight.com/electric-body-saw-65766.html
harbor freight just opened a store down the road here in NH. Life gets
better and better…Rich
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As in pulled the mast with the table still attached? LOL!!!
On 12/2/2010 12:33 PM, Adamlaw wrote:
Quote:This yard tried to pull my folding cabin table through the little hole in the coachroof. They are well-meaning.Adam Silverstein
-iPhoneOn Dec 2, 2010, at 1:48 PM, “Patrick “Peaboy” Walters” wrote:
Quote:IMHO, this is one of those have the yard do it things.-p
—
s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.comOn Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 7:54 AM, Pete Dubler wrote:
Quote:In the boat, you might try this tool
http://www.harborfreight.com/3-inch-composite-air-cut-off-tool-95028.html again, starting by drawing the line all the way around the mast. (wear a
dust mask when using this)I have one of these and use it to cut off things in places where I can’t
easily work with a saw.Pete
On 12/2/2010 7:03 AM, wrote:
Quote:This might make the job easier that a sawsall since its smaller and could
probably be easier to position around the mast. I’m sure it would cut
aluminum with no trouble.http://www.harborfreight.com/electric-body-saw-65766.html
harbor freight just opened a store down the road here in NH. Life gets
better and better…Rich
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My experience in dealing with my local boatyard is that everyone in the yard
has excellent trade skills and are very good at their individual technology
area. No one in the yard is a skilled project manager or has the ability to
take in an entire project, manage all the details and make sure all the
various phases of the project are done in the most desirable order for the
Owner.So I stay on top of everything they do, ask a lot of questions and treat
them like my own employees instead of partners. It’s working much better
that way for ME, not sure about how they feel, but don’t really care too
much since the yard is pretty empty and I’m the one writing checks. 😉-p
—
s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.comOn Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 1:26 PM, Pete Dubler wrote:
Quote:As in pulled the mast with the table still attached? LOL!!!On 12/2/2010 12:33 PM, Adamlaw wrote:
Quote:This yard tried to pull my folding cabin table through the little hole in
the coachroof. They are well-meaning.Adam Silverstein
-iPhoneOn Dec 2, 2010, at 1:48 PM, “Patrick “Peaboy” Walters”<
> wrote:IMHO, this is one of those have the yard do it things.
Quote:-p—
s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.comOn Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 7:54 AM, Pete Dubler
wrote:In the boat, you might try this tool
Quote:http://www.harborfreight.com/3-inch-composite-air-cut-off-tool-95028.html again, starting by drawing the line all the way around the mast. (wear a
dust mask when using this)I have one of these and use it to cut off things in places where I can’t
easily work with a saw.Pete
On 12/2/2010 7:03 AM, wrote:
This might make the job easier that a sawsall since its smaller and
Quote:could
probably be easier to position around the mast. I’m sure it would cut
aluminum with no trouble.http://www.harborfreight.com/electric-body-saw-65766.html
harbor freight just opened a store down the road here in NH. Life gets
better and better…Rich
Original Message
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Owners no more...
Thanks Dawn and Patrick! -
Yup. A laugh riot, punctuated by the splintering of teak. They made me do all the dangerous, stupid stuff too. I posted about the unstepping earlier.
Adam Silverstein
-iPhoneOn Dec 2, 2010, at 4:26 PM, Pete Dubler wrote:
Quote:As in pulled the mast with the table still attached? LOL!!!On 12/2/2010 12:33 PM, Adamlaw wrote:
Quote:This yard tried to pull my folding cabin table through the little hole in the coachroof. They are well-meaning.Adam Silverstein
-iPhoneOn Dec 2, 2010, at 1:48 PM, “Patrick “Peaboy” Walters” wrote:
Quote:IMHO, this is one of those have the yard do it things.-p
—
s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.comOn Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 7:54 AM, Pete Dubler wrote:
Quote:In the boat, you might try this tool
http://www.harborfreight.com/3-inch-composite-air-cut-off-tool-95028.html again, starting by drawing the line all the way around the mast. (wear a
dust mask when using this)I have one of these and use it to cut off things in places where I can’t
easily work with a saw.Pete
On 12/2/2010 7:03 AM, wrote:
Quote:This might make the job easier that a sawsall since its smaller and could
probably be easier to position around the mast. I’m sure it would cut
aluminum with no trouble.http://www.harborfreight.com/electric-body-saw-65766.html
harbor freight just opened a store down the road here in NH. Life gets
better and better…Rich
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It’s a shame that yards do these things…
On 12/2/2010 3:35 PM, Adamlaw wrote:
Quote:Yup. A laugh riot, punctuated by the splintering of teak. They made me do all the dangerous, stupid stuff too. I posted about the unstepping earlier.Adam Silverstein
-iPhoneOn Dec 2, 2010, at 4:26 PM, Pete Dubler wrote:
Quote:As in pulled the mast with the table still attached? LOL!!!On 12/2/2010 12:33 PM, Adamlaw wrote:
Quote:This yard tried to pull my folding cabin table through the little hole in the coachroof. They are well-meaning.Adam Silverstein
-iPhoneOn Dec 2, 2010, at 1:48 PM, “Patrick “Peaboy” Walters” wrote:
Quote:IMHO, this is one of those have the yard do it things.-p
—
s/v Deep Playa | Pearson 424 Hull #152 | http://www.DeepPlaya.comOn Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 7:54 AM, Pete Dubler wrote:
Quote:In the boat, you might try this tool
http://www.harborfreight.com/3-inch-composite-air-cut-off-tool-95028.html again, starting by drawing the line all the way around the mast. (wear a
dust mask when using this)I have one of these and use it to cut off things in places where I can’t
easily work with a saw.Pete
On 12/2/2010 7:03 AM, wrote:
Quote:This might make the job easier that a sawsall since its smaller and could
probably be easier to position around the mast. I’m sure it would cut
aluminum with no trouble.http://www.harborfreight.com/electric-body-saw-65766.html
harbor freight just opened a store down the road here in NH. Life gets
better and better…Rich
Original Message
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I’m puzzled by this story. I’ve helped pull my mast and other masts countless times. You have to have someone below to make sure that the mast doesn’t hit the steel bar on the way out and that the wiring harness doesn’t get snagged. If someone was below, it must have been pretty obvious that there was a table attached. If nobody was below, it makes me wonder if this was the first time the yard ever pulled a mast.
Rich.
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Yeah, there was. A big guy. Dark hair and a tee shirt. He called me down once the table started to lift up. I made him hug the spar and I got it detached without much more damage.
My fault I guess. They had me disconnect all the electrics and the triatic. Why should I assume they did the table?
Adam Silverstein
-iPhoneOn Dec 3, 2010, at 2:02 PM, wrote:
Quote:I’m puzzled by this story. I’ve helped pull my mast and other masts countless times. You have to have someone below to make sure that the mast doesn’t hit the steel bar on the way out and that the wiring harness doesn’t get snagged. If someone was below, it must have been pretty obvious that there was a table attached. If nobody was below, it makes me wonder if this was the first time the yard ever pulled a mast.Rich.
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Don’t cut off the bottom of the mast then try to build up the step. Build your new step, ideally out of G10 (Garolite) with the needed additional height, determine the new step height vs the old then cut that amount off the bottom of the mast. This is not at all an unusual repair. I had 3 projects this year that included new mast steps. Don’t put metal back under it. I’ve yet to see a boat with a dry mast step in a driving rain.
For the mizzen use a die grinder and a cut off disc to remove the old aluminum step if (it will be) stuck to the bottom of the mast. You can create a new step, G10 isn’t needed here, some 1/2 inch FRP laminated together to about 2.5 inches can be shaped to slide up into the mast, put a 1/8 inch base that mimics the shape of the outside diameter of the mast at the bottom of the stack and you have a step that wont fuse to the spar. Drill a drain hole in the mast just above the top of the new step.
Take Garolite to a shop that cuts granite counter tops to cut to shape. Much cheaper than blades.
I’m pulling my sticks next year and replacing my main mast step. Did the mizzen when I had the engine out.
Chuck
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