March 10, 2016 at 8:26 am #220193
BTW, Ewan, I see here on the website discussion page that each participant has an anonymous grey & white photo box above their name, while you, our esteemed master, have a color photo of one of the Blues Brothers. I’ve always wondered what some of these other guys look like that I’ve been ‘talking boats’ with all these years, but I don’t see anyplace to upload a profile photo. Am I missing the link, or is that still in the works?
March 10, 2016 at 8:50 am #220194Mark OppeParticipantPublished donor list is a good idea.Thanks Tor and Ewan.CheersMarkSv Mary Murray Pearson 424 ketch #164
Sent from my iPad
March 10, 2016 at 9:00 am #220196Idyll OursParticipant
Hello all,I recall early in our boating lives, while I was drooling over some new gadget or other at a boat show and bemoaning over the high sticker price a gentleman beside me said “you have to get used to it as the only thing cheap on a sailboat is the ownerâ.I resemble that remark so I am also very grateful for access via this web based forum to accomplished craftspeople with knowledge and experience offering free advice on when it is wise to spend the money.Thanks all,Jim
March 10, 2016 at 9:13 am #220197patnModerator
As someone who started and moderated this website for a long time,
there are lots of reasons people might not donate. We want the
proliferation of experience and ideas. Public shaming never really
works as it only reduces the number the participants and breadth of
People should realize that $25 from 55 people would cover Ewan’s
cost for this year ( as long as he contributes as well). After the
first year, I assume that cost would decrease as the maintenance
cost should be less than development. Maybe what should happen is
everyone gives $15/yr for 5 years. Would that make it more
– patTor wrote on 3/10/16 7:05 AM:
I’d also like to express my appreciation to the
other 22 Pearson 424 owners who have chipped in so that we
can have this excellent forum. Obviously you all value
your boats and this exchange as much as I do.
As for you 42 freeloaders who seem to think
it’s OK to benefit from the labor and largesse of others
while contributing nothing yourselves, I’d say you have
missed the proverbial boat here. You know who you are.
(Come to think of it, Ewan knows who you are, too! Would a
published “Donor and Idler” list be too politically
incorrect? Seems like perfectly commendable ‘full
disclosure’ to me, and it might ferret a few lurkers out
of the dark shadows. It certainly would help me and others
here know when we want to spend our time helping an
individual and when we’re just too busy to bother. What do
you think? Can I get an Amen?)
Ewan, as always, thank you.
Tor, Resident Troublemaker
Silverheels, P-424 #17
March 10, 2016 at 9:24 am #220201
HA! I think we need a LIKE button for these discussions.
March 10, 2016 at 9:45 am #220204robshookphotoParticipant
This is a site cached by Google, so I think it’s fair to assume that there are many like me who have never posted before who were researching their boat and stumbled in here.
I donated because I’m heading into a refit so the archives here are invaluable, but without that coming up I probably wouldn’t even see this thread or be aware of the site’s funding problems.
Maybe a paid benefit, even inconsequential would help.
Pearson 424 cutter - "Effie"
March 10, 2016 at 9:45 am #220205There actually is one! Check out the web interface – it’s below the responses. I’m investigating a starring mechanism too. And a way of surfacing the most popular conversations.More to come!
Admin | Pearson424.org
March 10, 2016 at 9:50 am #220207
I’m sure you’re right about public shaming. Sometimes I just say things to stir people up, and look. Now we’re having a discussion about this issue.
Some people can afford $50 or $100 for this service, others much less. One or two really can’t afford anything at all right now, and that’s fine – but not 42. Forty of those are virtually taking money out of Ewan’s pocket so that they can ride for free, even though they can easily afford 10 or 20 bucks for it. That’s freeloading by anyone’s definition, so they’ve earned a little shame – even if it’s not public. It isn’t so much the dollar amount as the participation. If everyone kicks in what they feel this forum is worth to them and can afford, then Ewan won’t have to pay it for us on top of doing all the work.
OK, so we scrap the public pillory. How about private whippings?
Silverheels, P-424 #17
March 10, 2016 at 9:53 am #220209
I’m a notorious troublemaker – rarely know when to keep my big mouth shut. I’ve cruised broke, too, my friend – for years! – so I know what you’re dealing with. If you can afford $5 or even $1, it’s more than enough, a fair share of the burden as much as the flush guy who contributed $100. If you can’t manage it now, then hopefully you can later. Or not. Chances are, though, that there are very few among the 42 in your present situation. I’d bet at least 40 of them can easily afford to donate something, however little, towards this service, made possible by Ewan’s selfless work while also covering a lion’s share of the expense.
You’re not one of the freeloaders in my book. In fact, I’d count you among the true cruising nobility – Tristan Jones, the Pardy’s, Capt. John Smith (and me for many years) – all of whom pulled it off on a shoestring budget, or less. Thanks for being part of this group.
Tor with his foot in his mouth
Silverheels, P-424 #17
March 10, 2016 at 8:13 pm #220232
Hey, Topaz. That was me expressing my opinion, not the Pearson group. I don’t speak for them.
And I’m really glad you have not supported me in my work, too.
March 10, 2016 at 8:20 pm #220234All,We’re here because we share a love of a particularly beautiful and functional sail boat, the Pearson 424. Like many emotions, this love can be expressed in different forms. And when love is present, our relationships can get damaged.I recognize that an earlier post may have been experienced as aggressive by some of you. I apologize for this and want to state very clearly that participation in funding he site is optional. So optional, in fact, that I will shortly remove the PayPal link from the site. My original intent was to provide some numbers on membership, participation and support – without specifically indicating any individuals.We appreciate all and any communication on this subject – truth is, the vibrancy and resilience of a community is evident in the way it deals with and grows from its challenges. By that measure I believe we’re doing well.Also don’t think Tor is part of Site Admin. He took it upon himself to express his views and certainly does not represent the will of the community. Any member of the community is entitled to their opinions and to express them in a respectful manner, from Tor to Topaz. If you’re abusive or threatening, you’ll be asked to stop. Banning is our last resort.Thanks always for your engagement and support.Ewan
Admin | Pearson424.org
March 10, 2016 at 10:13 pm #220235randyParticipant
Ewan, thanks for that conciliatory note. Truth be told, my initial
reaction to Tor’s post was similar to that of Topaz, but I decided to
chill a bit and chalk it up to a surplus of exuberance. Although I
can’t speak for anyone other than myself, I think to some extent the
decision to contribute is keyed to a degree of connected-ness
individual skippers have to the group that can only develop with a
pattern of interaction. Using words like lurker etc., tends to
emphasize insider-outsider status that is not condusive to that
interaction. So I agree with Ewan, let’s all work on enhancing the
community he is working hard to facilitate.
In that spirit, here is my intro: I am doing an extensive re-fit on
1981 ketch I bought wo years ago-this boat is everything I have always
dreamed of–and i am open to share some hard won experience. Some of
you may be interested in (or horrified by) some of my decisions
(example-taking heat exchanger and oil cooler off the back of the
W-Beast and moving all radiator hoses to port bulkhead and putting
remote oil change pump and dual remote oil filters on star bulkhead
with lines run back to the oil cooler (old oil filter is closed off
now). I am having an aluminum multi-purpose arch constructed that
will have retracteable dinghy davit extensions, mounts for wind,
removeable solar and radar insert posts to facilitate canal travel in
Europe. That’s still in the print phase, but once I have the
prototype, I will throw up a pic to see if anyone wants one. In the
two year I have been working on the boat, much has happened, new paint
on hull, all LEDS, new whale plumbing,replace sink with deep single,
new electric panels with separate AC and DC, lots more. I have gained
alot of storage by cutting holes. Behind shower, center-aft corners
of water tanks, behind stove (from top). Cut three more hatches into
cabin sole. This summer will feature a bit of cabinet work LOL. I
expect to splash the finished boat, hopefully with a couple of new
sails, in 2017 and head back out to the Atlantic (I’m on the hard in
Erie PA now).
I look forward to any advice (except don’t do it) on a propane on
demand hot water system fed from locker(s) set on transom top. I’m
thinking Bosch and wonder if it might make sense to broom the propane
locker to create more efficient use of lazarette storage and feed
galley stove from transom as well. I also need advice on designing the
ideal VHF antennae system. Does anybody have experience with the new
doodads that allow NMEA 183 to hear input from NMEA 2000? I have some
elements of both and upgrading radar, for example, to NMEA 2000 is not
in the budget.
March 10, 2016 at 10:43 pm #220247sumoceanParticipantTorJust for the record. I purchased your book Ready For Sea. So that kinda means I supported your work. Don’t hold back your comments are always well found in my opinion entertaining.Linus
March 11, 2016 at 7:03 am #220278
Thanks, Linus. I dislike free-riders and/or any of the other synonyms that apply (and seem to offend some people) at the expense of others, in this case our volunteer webmaster, and I don’t care who resents it. That’s my opinion – even if I do express it roughly sometimes. But Topaz was at least partially right about the bullying. I thought about it last night and realized that shaming, which in my exuberance I jokingly suggested, is a form of bullying. Even though I meant it as a joke, it was a bad one.
OK, I’ve said more than enough on that subject.
As for my comments about 424’s, if Randy (above) were to start a discussion thread about his intriguing innovations I would gladly offer a suggestion about hot-water-on-demand, which I lived with for 6 years and (again in my opinion) he me might later wish he’d done differently than what he described.
March 11, 2016 at 7:10 am #220279ewanolearyParticipantThanks Tor (and everyone!)I’m really interested in everyone’s experiences with on-demand hot water. Since I am switching to electric from diesel, I won’t have a heat exchanger to heat my water.Lets switch that to the General forum.Ewan
March 11, 2016 at 7:21 am #220316
I have added the field to profiles – feel free to upload your image there and we’ll see what happens!
Admin | Pearson424.org
March 11, 2016 at 9:29 am #220322
March 13, 2016 at 7:48 am #220328
I see here on the website that you wrote on Friday, “I have added the field to profiles – feel free to upload your image there and we’ll see what happens!” I never received that message by email, or the the one following (about Gravatar, which I don’t understand), nor any others since our discussion a few days ago about donating.
March 13, 2016 at 9:10 am #220330patnModeratorTorDo you do any kind of spam firing on the server side like “spam assassin”?– pat
Sent from my phone with automatic correct for your amusement
March 13, 2016 at 12:20 pm #220332Ken PageParticipantThis email just showed up on my spam?Ken
Taking what comes as I get it, using it all as much as I can and trying hard to leave all the shit behind.
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