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Thanks, David. Yes, I realize leeway (and current and a couple of other things) will affect your COG. I’m just hoping to compare apples to apples – well, genoas to Solents – by narrowing it down to one factor, the rig’s highest sailing (not pinching) angle to the true wind. I think the binnacle compass will tell you that, providing a fairly pure comparison of the two headsails. In fact, since 424’s point a bit better or worse according to their particular sails, rig tuning, etc., it would be extra revealing if you also take compass readings sometime when tacking with the genoa, to measure just how much better (assuming it is better) the Solent sail points than the jenny. I guess that’s what I’m most hoping to find out, how much difference it makes on a 424. (Is your Solent headsail sheeted inside the shrouds?)
I appreciate your feedback. I’ve never sailed a Solent rig, but am wide open to learn a new trick.
Tor
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Silverheels, P-424 #17
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David,
Perhaps there’s a non-electronic way to figure that out. Get the boat trimmed and moving well on one tack hard to windward and moving well under the Solent headsail, read the binnacle compass heading, tack, trim, and once she’s moving well again, take another compass reading. The difference, the number of compass degrees spanned tack to tack, is your true tacking angle, or at least that’s what I think of when I use the term. Does that make sense?
Silverheels’ little staysail can point much higher than her genoa because it sheets inside the shrouds. Unfortunately, it provides very little drive. I installed it more for the additional wind slot and to serve as a storm jib when reefed. Your Solent sounds like a genuine remedy for the 424’s lackluster pointing ability and I’m curious to know the extent of the improvement in terms I can relate to. So I’d love to learn what compass headings you achieve, tack to tack, if you get a chance to check that out sometime.
Thanks,
Tor
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Silverheels, P-424 #17
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David,
What do 32-33 degrees apparent tacking angles equal in true wind angles? Or to ask it another way, from port tack to starboard tack (or vice versa), what is the total tacking angle?
Thanks,
Tor
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Silverheels, P-424 #17
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I didn’t know it was broken, Ewan. Just figured nobody had anything to say, or that I had been de-listed (again). Glad to see it’s meeting with your approval again. Seems to be working well at this end.
Tor
Hey Bob,
You’re probably all correct. Which widget is “better” usually depends on how you use your boat – cruisers’ needs differ, sometimes widely, from day sailors’ & weekenders’, let alone racers’ (Rich) – on personal preferences regarding the trade-offs (there are always trade-offs) and, of course, budget. I have the fixed 3-blade that came with my boat, albeit re-pitched for the new engine. Had there been a Max-Prop on her or (probably) the one being discussed here, I’d have that. Sometimes the deciding factor is simple inertia.
Tor
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Silverheels, P-424 #17
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This is the first email I’ve received from the group since April 11th. Sorry to hear you had a bug. Glad to see you’ve (maybe) fixed it.
Reef early,
Tor
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Silverheels, P-424 #17
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Right, I said “up an inch or two,” but I believe my ‘glass repair guy went up higher than that. Not nearly 15″, but more than an inch or two.
Tor
Ken,
I’m about 50/50 between wanting crew and wanting to single-hand the passage, which in some ways is a lot simpler. I’ll just go with the flow on that.
I ought to reach the Grenadines by the 1st of June and plan to be based in Tyrell Bay, Carriacou. Still, I’ll be getting down to Grenada once in a while to do some waterfalls hiking, so we’ll have opportunities to hook up. Looking forward to it!
Tor
Ewan,
I see here on the website that you wrote on Friday, “I have added the field to profiles – feel free to upload your image there and we’ll see what happens!” I never received that message by email, or the the one following (about Gravatar, which I don’t understand), nor any others since our discussion a few days ago about donating.
Tor
Thanks, Linus. I dislike free-riders and/or any of the other synonyms that apply (and seem to offend some people) at the expense of others, in this case our volunteer webmaster, and I don’t care who resents it. That’s my opinion – even if I do express it roughly sometimes. But Topaz was at least partially right about the bullying. I thought about it last night and realized that shaming, which in my exuberance I jokingly suggested, is a form of bullying. Even though I meant it as a joke, it was a bad one.
OK, I’ve said more than enough on that subject.
As for my comments about 424’s, if Randy (above) were to start a discussion thread about his intriguing innovations I would gladly offer a suggestion about hot-water-on-demand, which I lived with for 6 years and (again in my opinion) he me might later wish he’d done differently than what he described.
Tor
Hey, Topaz. That was me expressing my opinion, not the Pearson group. I don’t speak for them.
And I’m really glad you have not supported me in my work, too.
Reef early,
Tor
Windward,
I’m a notorious troublemaker – rarely know when to keep my big mouth shut. I’ve cruised broke, too, my friend – for years! – so I know what you’re dealing with. If you can afford $5 or even $1, it’s more than enough, a fair share of the burden as much as the flush guy who contributed $100. If you can’t manage it now, then hopefully you can later. Or not. Chances are, though, that there are very few among the 42 in your present situation. I’d bet at least 40 of them can easily afford to donate something, however little, towards this service, made possible by Ewan’s selfless work while also covering a lion’s share of the expense.
You’re not one of the freeloaders in my book. In fact, I’d count you among the true cruising nobility – Tristan Jones, the Pardy’s, Capt. John Smith (and me for many years) – all of whom pulled it off on a shoestring budget, or less. Thanks for being part of this group.
Tor with his foot in his mouth
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Silverheels, P-424 #17
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Tor
Hi Pat,
I’m sure you’re right about public shaming. Sometimes I just say things to stir people up, and look. Now we’re having a discussion about this issue.
Some people can afford $50 or $100 for this service, others much less. One or two really can’t afford anything at all right now, and that’s fine – but not 42. Forty of those are virtually taking money out of Ewan’s pocket so that they can ride for free, even though they can easily afford 10 or 20 bucks for it. That’s freeloading by anyone’s definition, so they’ve earned a little shame – even if it’s not public. It isn’t so much the dollar amount as the participation. If everyone kicks in what they feel this forum is worth to them and can afford, then Ewan won’t have to pay it for us on top of doing all the work.
OK, so we scrap the public pillory. How about private whippings?
Tor
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Silverheels, P-424 #17
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I’d also like to express my appreciation to the other 22 Pearson 424 owners who have chipped in so that we can have this excellent forum. Obviously you all value your boats and this exchange as much as I do.
As for you 42 freeloaders who seem to think it’s OK to benefit from the labor and largesse of others while contributing nothing yourselves, I’d say you have missed the proverbial boat here. You know who you are. (Come to think of it, Ewan knows who you are, too! Would a published “Donor and Idler” list be too politically incorrect? Seems like perfectly commendable ‘full disclosure’ to me, and it might ferret a few lurkers out of the dark shadows. It certainly would help me and others here know when we want to spend our time helping an individual and when we’re just too busy to bother. What do you think? Can I get an Amen?)
Ewan, as always, thank you.
Tor, Resident Troublemaker
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Silverheels, P-424 #17
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