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I have what ever you’re smoking
AlanSent from my iPhone
Quote:On Sep 24, 2013, at 3:34 PM, “Silverheels” wrote:John,
Another reminder of why I don’t cruise in the US anymore. Over-aggressive
tax extortion – I mean, 90 days? Give me a break! – gun-&-boot-clad Coast
Guard “safety inspections,” Marine Police harassment in port and underway,
stone-faced Homeland Security thugs roaring by in black rocket ships that we
paid for, ubiquitous anchoring restrictions and outright bans, tip to tip
private waterfront and $100/night dockage. No other country I’ve cruised
treats small yachts so shabbily. I’m old enough to remember a kinder, freer,
more courteous American coast, one I used to explore by boat as a free
citizen, a respected young adventurer and a welcomed guest, where the Coast
Guard were the good guys, there when you needed help even if only a friendly
tow into the harbor, not a coastal police force with leveled deck canons and
notches in their guns. Maybe there are still pockets of that America left,
some cruiser-friendly harbors where the town docks are free to anyone who
cares to tie up for a few days, where folks offer a handshake instead of an
invoice, where moorings haven’t crowded out any possibility of anchoring and
the police are there to Serve and Protect, not just top off their ticket
quotas. I believe there is still a bit of that left, but it seems like you
have to run some tough gauntlets to find them – and you better not stay too
long.IMHO.
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Lee,
What hull number did you have?
If you don’t mind me asking, What did you get for her.
AlanSent from my iPhone
On Sep 1, 2013, at 3:44 PM, Lee Yonkers wrote:
I have sold Morning Glory. Please remove me from the list. It was great while it lasted.
Lee Yonkers
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I would strongly suggest purchasing a vacuum gauge that replaces the T handle in the Racore filter. It will tell you when the filter is clogged or before it clogs.
AlanSent from my iPhone
On Aug 29, 2013, at 3:10 PM, John Stevenson wrote:
Paul,
When I purchased Sarah in 2000 I was also concerned about sludge and water
in a then 20 year old tank. I considered doing something similar to what
Tor did or renting a fuel polishing set up. Never did either. In the
first year of my ownership I took Sarah to Bermuda and back. The trip over
was almost all motoring. When I got to Bermuda the Racor filter was clean
and no water in the bowl. So I figured the tank was clean and worried
about other things.
In 2008, after a lot more off-shore motoring, I repowered and replaced the
fuel tank. When the yard was getting ready to remove the tank they first
pumped out all of the fuel with a big 125VAC pump. Initially they dropped
the hose down to the bottom of the tank. They started the pump and it
immediately collapsed the hose. They pulled up the hose and it was clogged
with sludge. As everyone says “I’d rather be lucky than good”.
So I’d recommend doing something like what Tor did rather my ignorance is
bliss approach.Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.comOn Thu, Aug 29, 2013 at 2:48 PM, Silverheels wrote:
Paul,
This subject has come up before, most recently a month ago. My comment then
was as follows:My 424 had been sitting on the hard for unknown months when I bought her.
One of the very first things I did, just before (mostly) motoring her 300
miles up the ICW to another boat yard, was to remove and replace that foggy
portlight in the cockpit sole so I could see through it, and pull the
30-year-old fuel sight gauge and replace it with a new one, readily
available from any marine store for $10 or $15. While those things were
out,
I secured a hose to a long stick with wire ties, gently lowered the end
through the sight gauge hole to the tank’s deepest point, which is at the
forward end of the tank, and used a hand pump to suck out about a gallon or
so of fuel from there. To my delight it came up clean and free of water, so
I figured (correctly, as it turned out) that it was safe to use. If it had
come up ugly, I would probably have pumped out more until it showed clear,
or if it looked too far gone, arranged for polishing.Of course, I had the advantage of a boat that had been on the hard for a
long time. Any water and most dirt in the fuel tank would long ago have
settled to the deepest part of the tank. But even if your boat has been
sitting in a calm slip for a week, I believe you’d find most if not all of
the gunk settled to the bottom.Of course, you can unwittingly take on dirty fuel anytime. I have been
saved
more than once by having twin Racor fuel filters / water separators between
the tank and the engine, with a valve to switch from one to the other
instantly if one gets clogged by sludge.Reef early,
Tor
Silverheels, P-424 #17
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The scuttlebutt around the marina is that the C. G. found the boat with the transom ladder down and the prop fouled.
Make your own assumptions.
AlanSent from my iPhone
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Last winter there was a Niagara 42 that hit a partially submerged shipping container, they believe. It was about 30 miles north of the entrance to Elizabeth Harbor in Georgetown Bahamas. A well traveled area. The boat sank in 20 minutes!
Crew was saved. Never heard any more about the boat.
Alan
Sent from my iPhoneOn Aug 8, 2013, at 4:49 PM, “quent” wrote:
Something to check when you replace seacocks. Everything near the keel is pretty thick. The bottom at the turn of the bilge is thinner. The port forward deck drain exits the bottom at a seacock under the quarter berth. The bottom there on Clairebuoyant is less than 1/4″ thick. That’s the one I think about at night.
I think that I would hit the container dead on, where the hull is really thick, rather than risk ripping open her flanks. Remember the Titanic.
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I would dare say that with all of the 424’s in use and all of the sea miles they have traveled through the years, that the hull thickness is proper where it needs to be.
Just saying
AlanSent from my iPhone
On Aug 8, 2013, at 3:19 PM, wrote:
Quote:There must be an easier way to test hull thinness rather than drilling holes. Someone must make an ultrasonic gizmo that does this. Try searching ebay for ultrasonic hull thickness gauge.If you endup drilling all those holes however, I’d be interested in learning the results.
Regards
Rich Carter
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I would probably stay away from submerged shipping containers.
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On Aug 8, 2013, at 1:34 PM, Mizzenmonkey wrote:
As you correctly note, each hull is different. The encapsulated front of the keel is good for hitting stuff. The hollow keelbox is bad for blocking when hauled. You need to get a drill and drill through each section of your hull, noting the various thicknesses. (Please post results)
Adam Silverstein
On Aug 7, 2013, at 8:44 PM, “Page Two” wrote:
Has anyone found that there are variations in the hull thickness of the 424’s, and what have you found it to be in different locations if at all? Having a machinist background, I would appreciate estimates in 1/32″ if not 1/64″. Decimals is what I really love though!!! 🙂 I guess my question is based from being a wood boat guy and not really at all familiar with the methods of laying-up fiberglass back in the 80’s.
Is it thicker closer to the keel? Maybe less up forward where possibly a forward head would have thru-hulls?
I’m just curious, and want to visualize about the impact resistance of the hull.
Writing a New Chapter Page by Page in an Old Book.— m2f
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Jack,
Gasket ,…. You come from a great yard. I am sure they can take a look at it.
AlanSent from my iPhone
On Aug 2, 2013, at 3:31 PM, “calicojack” wrote:
Hi Guys
I have an engine problem on my trusty (or crusty) ‘ole Westerbeke. One of the head bolts is seeping oil around the top of the bolt. I’ve heard everything from I have a blown head gasket to I just need to re torque the head. Anybody experienced this?
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The problem is, you can be the most prudent, seaworthy and nautical looking sailor out there. Doing everything according to Chapmans, Duttons and Goodlander…. It’s the other guy and his boat that you have worry about.
And just a word about premiums, just like medical insurance, if everyone had to pay out of pocket (large deductible plans) instead if a 20$ co-pay, the insurance business would be far different. People would ask more questions and make better decisions instead of just plunking down their 20 bucks and never asking the cost. Would you have your boat worked on like that or your car?
Sorry just a rant.
AlanSent from my iPhone
On Aug 2, 2013, at 5:59 AM, “Silverheels” wrote:
Quote:A perfectly valid opinion, John, and you may well be right. Still, “if it
were me,” I’d give it a shot. Actually, when it was me, I did. The one time
I bought boat insurance I buried the agency in resumes, credentials,
magazine articles and a squeaky clean record until they must’ve thought I
was Robin Knox Johnson incognito. As a result I not only got a rock-bottom
rate, but also single-hander coverage for the US East Coast, the Caribbean,
the Atlantic (US to Europe), and the Mediterranean. I won’t tell you what I
paid – it would break your heart – but it was quite reasonable. Of course,
they still made their money on me since I never made a claim in the 6 years
they insured me.All this is to say, in the words of Henry Ford, “Whether you think you can
or you can’t, you’re right.”🙂
Silverheels, P-424 #17
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LH prop.
RH props walk to port.
AlanSent from my iPhone
On Jul 27, 2013, at 6:52 PM, “pma_foyl” wrote:
Hi Everyone,
I’d love to know if other 424 owners experience a starboard prop-walk in reverse? Is this a product of a v-drive/LH prop?
Or did I just misinterpret what I was experiencing?
Thanks,
paul
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I’ve never looked at my fuel tank gauge. I strictly go on engine hours. Fill up the tank, calculate 1 gallon for every hour of engine. You’ll probably only use about .8 gallons per engine hour, so that gives you a good 20% safety factor. Unless of course you run it wide-open throttle.
Alan
UnabatedSent from my iPhone
On Jul 21, 2013, at 10:06 AM, John Stevenson wrote:
Paul,
I can’t provide any advise on the tank gauge. I replaced my tank and guage
several years ago, and the gauge orientation on my boat is likely different
than yours. Actually, I would guess the gauge orientation varies from 424
to 424, even those with the original tank.
IMO eight months is not really that long for fuel to sit, although your
boat has been sitting in a rain forest. Fuel polishing is not a bad idea,
but the Racor filters can be replaced underway without problems. Just keep
a small jug of diesel fuel handy to re-fill the filter bowl after changing
the filter to avoid having to bleed the fuel lines. Take a lot of spare
filter cartridges with you.Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.comOn Sun, Jul 21, 2013 at 9:45 AM, Paul Audi wrote:
Hi Everyone,
So I’m a new P424 owner. I’ve actually owned one before and been a part of
the maillist, but since selling our last 424, I’ve mostly been a “list
stalker”. You’ll probably get a lot of questions from me in the coming
months as I try to figure out this new boat and all the systems.I’m currently prepping to deliver the boat from the present location
(Anacortes, WA) to Seattle. Hopefully it will be an easy 2-day trip, but of
course, I’m overwhelmed with pre-travel work, new boat-owner anxiety and
uncertainty with some of the PO’s systems.Today, I actually have a couple easy questions for the group (or hopefully
easy). Can anyone provide some information regarding the “fuel gauge arrow”
(on the old original tank-mounted gauge you look at through the cockpit
sole). Which way should it point, if the tank is full? If it’s empty? The
glass is so foggy that I can see the needle, but I can’t make out any other
markings (ie. F or E). The broker says he knows, but I’m alittle less than
confident with his answer.Another fuel question: do you think I require fuel polishing if the diesel
has been sitting for 8 months? Again, the broker thinks it’s fine. The
Racor looks very clear at this point (from running during sea trail), but
once that tank sloshes around, who knows. I’d love some feedback. The last
thing I want is a clogged filter/failing engine while transiting Deception
Pass.It’s a drop-in Racor (I’ve never had this before). If I had to replace it,
can I accomplish it underway? Can I replace it without bleeding the lines
(ie. putting new element in and topping up the filter canister with
diesel)?Any input or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you,
P
Paul
Talisman, Seattle WA
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John
I’ve heard that story before from many other people trying to experiment with the rope attached to the stern of the boat. The shock as you fall off the boat, trying to swim to the rope or back to the boat, even in flat calm seas is almost impossible. I can’t even imagine doing it in rough seas.
I’ve also heard of people attached to the boat alongside, being dragged and finding it impossible to climb up the freeboard back into the boat because you’re being dragged along.
I highly doubt that any of us would be able to pull ourselves up the tether line and back into the boat. Talk about trolling for sharks.
AlanSent from my iPhone
On Jul 18, 2013, at 9:34 AM, John Stevenson wrote:
Back in the late 70’s, when I and friends were first starting to sail
off-shore, one of us proposed that we trail a line off the stern for a
potential overboard rescue. We decided to test it. trailing a line with
several loops tied in. We motored the boat at about 4 kts in flat seas and
each of us took a turn jumping overboard and attempting a self-rescue.
The line was only 40′ long and I was one of the three (total of 5 guys)
who managed to catch the last loop in the line. Then I almost drowned as I
was pulled through the water at 4 kts. I couldn’t pull myself forward far
enough to grab the second loop. We were all young and in good shape then,
although I don’t deny there was some alcohol consumed before and during the
experiment, which ended when we managed to wrap the line on the prop.With a crew on board it might have facilitated at retrieval – stop the boat
and pull the fool on board, but it would have been of no use for
single-handing. Much better to stay on board.Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.comOn Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 7:49 AM, Robert Fine wrote:
Tan lines for just the pfd? You must have presented quite a sight. 🙂
I’m not being terse. This is from my mobile.
On Jul 18, 2013 7:14 AM, “Alan” wrote:As jack Tyler once said, better to spend $$ on keeping yourself on the
boat, than trying to figure out how to get yourself back on it.
I always have jack lines (1 inch nylon webbing) rigged down both sides of
boat. Use them religiously when ever I leave the cockpit when I sailalone.
Also have an EPIRB attached to Inflatable PFD/harness.
When I was in the Caribbean and working on my all over tan, I had tan
lines in the shape of my PFD. I know ….. TMI.
AlanSent from my iPhone
On Jul 18, 2013, at 6:45 AM, “” <
> wrote:When a captain I know needs to do a single-handed delivery, he trails
100 foot of line off the stern. He hasn’t had to use it yet but says, “if
you go overboard, the water displacement of the boat’s motion will suckyou
behind the boat where you have a chance of grabbing the line.” Tying a
type-four to the end wouldn’t be a bad idea either.Roger
On Jul 18, 2013, at 6:11 AM, Alan wrote:
http://online.wsj.com/article/AP587e2ddd4d1e4eb193aec19f1b9a8f22.html
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As jack Tyler once said, better to spend $$ on keeping yourself on the boat, than trying to figure out how to get yourself back on it.
I always have jack lines (1 inch nylon webbing) rigged down both sides of boat. Use them religiously when ever I leave the cockpit when I sail alone.
Also have an EPIRB attached to Inflatable PFD/harness.
When I was in the Caribbean and working on my all over tan, I had tan lines in the shape of my PFD. I know ….. TMI.
AlanSent from my iPhone
On Jul 18, 2013, at 6:45 AM, “” wrote:
When a captain I know needs to do a single-handed delivery, he trails 100 foot of line off the stern. He hasn’t had to use it yet but says, “if you go overboard, the water displacement of the boat’s motion will suck you behind the boat where you have a chance of grabbing the line.” Tying a type-four to the end wouldn’t be a bad idea either.
Roger
On Jul 18, 2013, at 6:11 AM, Alan wrote:
http://online.wsj.com/article/AP587e2ddd4d1e4eb193aec19f1b9a8f22.html
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With the exception of #6, I am sure we all have similar rules.
Being a singlehander I know I have occasional bent my own rules. No one around…. Whose gonna know…
Just saying…I guess it just takes once!
AlanSent from my iPhone
On Jul 17, 2013, at 9:33 PM, pete wrote:
Quote:Standing orders aboard s/v Regina Oceani:
1: while on watch, don’t run into anything
2: no peeing over the side
3: all crew shall sit while using the head
4: orders 2 & 3 go double for females on board
5: it is always ok to awaken the skipper if you have any doubts or concerns
6: there will be no cooking of bacon Spaniard (one smell that definitely makes me sea sick)
7: all crew shall wear pfd/harness when going forward after dark (and most other times while underway)Sent from my Android smartphone with a spell checker that is programmed to entertain you.
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I agree, in order to force water through the engine you’d have to push past the water pump impellers.
AlanSent from my iPhone
On Jul 16, 2013, at 3:43 PM, John Stevenson wrote:
Bob,
I’m at least skeptical. However I noticed that MainSail (Compass Marine)
posted the same warning on a forum a few years ago (
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f115/external-raw-water-strainer-65505.html).
This guy is pretty knowledgeable, and generally not an alarmist.Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.comOn Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 3:15 PM, Robert Fine wrote:
The whole ‘forcing water into the engine’ thing is, in my mind, bs. The
amount of pressure required to force water through the whole system
including the raw water pump is ridiculously high. By that I mean 10s of
pounds per square inch – far more than you could ever generate moving at 8
knots through the water. There are boats that use speed through the water
to cool engines but they move very fast and have very large scoops.But I could be wrong.
Bob
On Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 1:56 PM, John Stevenson <
wrote:
Rich,
I agree, going with the round (no scoop) screen would not force waterinto
the system. The yard also said if I put the scoop on backwards (facing
aft) I would not have a problem, but that would defeat the purpose of the
scoop. For now I have left the engine intake un-screened. Again that
advice on the scoop screen may be baseless.I sized the screen such that even when half the screen was clogged by
debris I would still have full flow into my 1-1/2″ thru-hull. Irecommend
doing the same with the round screen.
I think you will find that most of the debris that might collect on the
screen will be brushed off once you are underway.
I don’t know which is worse for clogging seawater systems, weeds or sea
nettles, but I am sure the sea nettles are worse to remove. My frigwould
suck in 2 or 3 then they would die and turn into super glue. Often they
didn’t get to the strainer and just die in the hose from the valve. With
the screen on this intake I’ve never had a sea nettle clog the system.Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.comOn Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 1:31 PM, wrote:
Thanks John,
I see two types of screens, one is round and the other is scooped. Isee
no mounting instructions so I don’t know which way the scoop is
supposed
to
face. If I put the round type on, I don’t see how it could force water
into the system. I’m not convinced that it won’t still get weed caughtin
it and eventually clog. Unlike the raw-water strainer, there is no
convenient way to clean it however. Draggers pull up great clumps ofweed.
This sometimes finds its way into our mooring area. These are big
clumps
Quote:of weed. If I sucked one into even a 1.5 inch intake, I think it might
clog though I might be able to pull the weed through.Rich
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