Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
I was just about to write exactly what Tor wrote,
so I 2nd it.
Be careful when you put the new bearing in that you
have removed ALL… and I do mean ALL marks made by
saw. One little bump and you’ll get the bearing about
2/3’s of the way in and it will get stuck. You will
then need to saw the new bearing out… and start
over…. on 2nd thought, just buy 2 bearings the first
time and save yourself the headache of having to wait
for the 2nd one to arrive….
How do I know this?
alan— Silver Heels <> wrote:
Quote:Rich,Unfortunately, you can’t use a press on all 424
cutlass bearings. The
bearing chamber (or shaft tube) in my boat’s strut
wraps around and closes
at its forward end like a blunt, hollow-point
bullet, leaving only enough of
a hole for the shaft to pass through. So you can’t
get anything like a
washer up against the forward end of the bearing to
pull it out. I
ultimately had to cut a lengthwise wedge out of the
old bearing with a
sawzall to loosen it enough so I could tap it out of
there. This necessarily
left cuts in the chamber’s forward enclosure, but it
doesn’t matter. They
can be used to guide the sawzall blade next time the
old cutlass bearing
refuses to budge. In fact, next time I may just
slice the forward end off
the chamber, making it an open tube that would allow
the use of a press.One little trick I learned from the yard manager
here. When I installed the
new cutlass bearing, I left about an inch of it
sticking out of the rear end
of the chamber, enough to grab with a pipe wrench so
that I might be able to
work it out next time. This also left an inch of
space at the bearing’s
forward end, so I can at least get a punch up
against it through the shaft
hole. Hope I don’t have to mess with it for another
10 years, though.Tor
Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us
Quote:
Original Message
<.. snip>Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
I have heard that if the boat is used heavily in
shallow and sandy waters – Bahamas…. then the
bearings wear out sooner.
Also, be sure you check the wear on the shaft. Mine
was worn so much that even with a new bearing there
would have still have been play in it.
I ended up replacing the shaft. Orginal shaft was
bronze.
alan____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
Welcome to boating my friend… what is it that West
Marine says…. We make boating more fun!!!!.— Aaron Lynch <> wrote:
Hey all, I just posted some pix of my
not-yet-complete bilge project.https://www.pearson424.org/gallery/Bilge-on-Ra
So here¹s how this little project went,
I wanted a horn at the spreaders. When I went to
install it, I had
difficulty getting the wiring in the mast because
there was a lot of old
crap. So I pulled that out.
And re-wired from the binnacle to the spreaders. In
doing that I found oil
in the bilge, suddenly clearing up the mystery of
the disappearing oil.The original Bilge Pump left several inches of water
in the bilge, topped
with about a gallon of oil.So I decided to redo the bilge pump setup as per
suggestions from the list,
but the shower sump was in the way, so I had to
relocate that, (as in I had
to rent a sawzall) which in turn meant having to
relocate the raw water
strainer.When I removed the sump hose, I discovered that the
seacock would not shut
off. SO I replaced that.(I did however talk my girlfriend into crawling into
the bilge to help clean
it. Again thanks to the list I was able to say ³see
hun, other admirals do
it, it would be Œweird¹ if you refused²)The best place to put the new sump was occupied by
the holding tank
discharge. SO I had to relocate that, which meant a
couple new hoses.So I decided to replace ALL of the sanitation hoses.
In the course of this,
I discovered that the discharge pump went straight
to the seacock without a
vented loop. Meaning that a small check valve in
the pump was all that was
keeping the seawater out of the holding tank.While it was out, I rebuilt the discharge pump,
where I discovered that the
check valve didn¹t in fact close all the way, which
suddenly explained why
the holding tank was full even if we didn¹t use it
for a week.While I had nearly every friggin hose and wire in
the bilge exposed I needed
to climb into all of the aft lazzarettes, and since
I had all that crap out
of the boat I did a deep spring cleaning to
inventory the boat and add
everything into John¹s excel spreadsheet.But then it was dark, and supposed to rain and so I
had to put it all back,
and now I have to take it back out to inventory it
so damned you John and
your cool excel spreadsheet!!!!Or and my boat is a friggin¹ deathtrap.
I still don¹t have the raw water pump or the sump
reinstalled or even found
the oil leak yet.
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:
____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
Well, the reason I mentioned it is, last year, I
finished installing the deck fittings for the Solent
Stay. I had used the drawings provided by Jack Tyler,
and I believe John Stevenson. Never gave it a thought
and had the parts made. When I went to install the
backing plate inside the anchor locker, I discovered,
much to my dismay, The plate was too long. I am
thinking maybe my locker is a bit shallow compared to
other 424’s. No panic though, I just drilled another
set of holes (3/8’s stainless) and mounted the plate
sideways.
Rum on a Friday evening, imagine that. Barbacourt?
alan____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
Well, the reason I mentioned it is, last year, I
finished installing the deck fittings for the Solent
Stay. I had used the drawings provided by Jack Tyler,
and I believe John Stevenson. Never gave it a thought
and had the parts made. When I went to install the
backing plate inside the anchor locker, I discovered,
much to my dismay, The plate was too long. I am
thinking maybe my locker is a bit shallow compared to
other 424’s. No panic though, I just drilled another
set of holes (3/8’s stainless) and mounted the plate
sideways.
Rum on a Friday evening, imagine that. Barbacourt?
alan____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
I have some pictures here someplace. I’ll have to
scarf around and see what I did with ’em. I’ll be out
there on the weekend in any event and take more.
I used 1 1/2 PVC. It uses 2 45’s, a straight length
and then another 45 I think. I’ll take some pictures.
I have to tell ya, it’s a science experiment to get
it to work right. Pearson didn’t make it easy.
alan
— Aaron Lynch <> wrote:I¹d really
like to see a picture of the underside if you ever
get a chance. Also,
what size pipe did you use? Is the straight or are
there any elbows in it?On 4/24/08 2:50 PM, alan P wrote :
Attached is the windlass I put on last summer. A
PVC
pipe goes through the anchor locker into the chain
locker below. I have it angled such that it forcesthe
chain to the aft end of the chain locker so it can
pile up higher before it gets jammed. I have had150
ft of 5/16 HT out and retrieved without issue.
Much
more than that it’s hit and miss.
alan______________________________________________________________________________
______
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:
____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
Attached is the windlass I put on last summer. A PVC
pipe goes through the anchor locker into the chain
locker below. I have it angled such that it forces the
chain to the aft end of the chain locker so it can
pile up higher before it gets jammed. I have had 150
ft of 5/16 HT out and retrieved without issue. Much
more than that it’s hit and miss.
alan____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
Duct tape wound around a dowel or paper towel tube
works too. Work it like your taking lint of a sweater.
alan— Silver Heels <> wrote:
Quote:That is a good tip about the shower water
temperature, Bob. I’d always
thought cold was better for post-‘glass clean-up,
but what you say makes
sense. I do cover myself pretty well, though: hat,
broad headband over my
forehead, goggles, disposable nose-&-mouth filtering
mask, long sleeve shirt
buttoned all the way up in front, gloves, long
trousers, socks & shoes. This
is not as thorough as the pros’ suits & masks, but
for my little jobs it
seems adequate. So far no itching when I wear it
all.Thank goodness summer hasn’t arrived yet in NE
Florida! I’m hoping to have
the ‘glass work done before then. The temperatures
this week are a
comfortable 70’s & low 80’s.Tor
Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us
Original Message
<.. snip>Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
I got a call that my set and two others(you know who
you are) are on the way also.
alan
more work!— Robert Fine <> wrote:
Hi Tor,
Why are you getting rid of the locker? (oh, and
rumor has it my mast
pulpits are on the way! Yippee!)Bob
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 10:40 AM, Silver Heels
<> wrote:I’m in the process of altering Silver Heels’
anchor locker and foredeck to
accommodate a new electric windlass and some
other stuff. In the process I will be decking overthe foredeck solid,
like most boats’ foredecks are, and dispensing
with Pearson’s opening anchor well hatch. Doesanyone want the original
hatch lid? Mine includes a box-like protuberance
meant to cover a windlass beneath it (photosattached).
Tor
Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.3/1393 –Release Date: 4/23/2008
8:12 AM
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:
—
Bob Fine
Fine Software LLC
Your data on the web your way. No kidding____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
OK, ya got me…. what is a vent whistle? I am sure it
goes in the vent, but after that…..I am not sure
alan
— Aaron Lynch <> wrote:I replaced the whole port with a stainless model
with plate glass which I
picked up at minney¹s for $20. It was an impulse
type deal, saw the thing
for sale and thought ³I can use that and it¹s a good
price.²SO I ended up slightly enlarging the hole and
installing the new one.Then, I ended up also installing a vent whistle
(which I think is the best
thing I ever bought BTW), so now I almost never look
at the gauge.On 4/22/08 5:59 AM, John Stevenson wrote :
Rodd,
On Sarah the sight glass was removable. Just aBeckson deck plate with clear
plastic cover. Well, it was clear at one time –
long before I owned the boat.
However, since it was removable it didn’t really
matter how clear it was. A
couple of summer’s ago the frame for the deck
plate cracked and I had to
replace it. The only thing available at the time
(this was in Cartagena,
Spain) was an opaque deck plate, which is what is
fitted in Sarah’s cockpit
today.
Of course even with the deck plate cover removedit was still very difficult
to read the gauge as it had become even more
cloudy than that the old “clear”
sight glass.
If your sight glass is not removable and you haveto replace it you might
consider getting a sturdy removable deck plate
(clear or opaque). The drawback
to a removable cover is that inevitably some water
will get on the top of the
tank and have to be sponged up periodically.
John
On Tue, Apr 22, 2008 at 8:37 AM, Joseph Steiner
<> wrote:
yes, it’s a bitch. I haven’t replaced mine, but a
trick I use is to make it wet with a film ofwater and
shine a flashlight through it to see the gauge. I
don’t need to do it often, so it’s not so onerousa
task. Try to sail as much as possible.
Joe,
Half Moon.
— Rodd Leeds <> wrote:has anyone replaced the plastic in the fuel
gauge
sight glass in the cockpit sole? I can barely
see
the gauge through the lexan and would like to
replace it. I removed the aluminum ring fromthe
cockpit, but I can’t figure out how to get the
lexan
out. The bottom ring which I thought was a
rubber
gasket seems to be made of metal as well. Any
ideas
would be appreciated.
Rodd Leeds
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:
____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
Jack Rabbit has a lot of great technical material and
such, but the prices are way too high. I prefer to
read all his ideas and then buy at GenuineDealz.com.
Nice work Linus…
alan
— Linus Sumocean <> wrote:
Torn rotator cuff. I guess from lifting the 50 lb
inverter while lying on my back trying to reach in the
wiring closet. Makes it hard to sleep, but the advice
from the docs at the bar ” you just gotta work through
it “. Also like Joe said, only they suggest red wine
instead of rum and vicodin.I have to agree with Bob Fine’s comment about Jack
Rabbit marine from his blog. Peter was very helpful
when I was looking to buy. The web site is helpful
and encourages you to call for advice. I purchased a
Victron Multiplus inverter charger, remote control,
some fuses, buss bars, battery switch and an ACR. I
received most of my order in two weeks. The inverter
did not show up for a while. My emails did not get
answered and by the time I finally got through on the
phone I was worried. I received the inverter and
remote and the next day I got another inverter with a
packing slip that said the remote control was on back
order. I shipped the second one back and they
reimbursed me for the shipping. When I got to the
boat with the battery switch the breaker for the house
power was broken. After two tries I got a replacement
that would fit in the panel. At this point I realized
from being in the service sector that I was becoming “
that customer “. I finally got the inverter in and
wired on Friday. The installation instructions are
minimal but it is fairly simple to install an
inverter. The temp sense was the last thing that
needed to be wired and the screw blocks on the circuit
board of the inverter are missing. I was in a hurry
because I needed to get back home to work and got
frustrated and just left. It’s possible that the
blocks are in the plastic bag that had the fuses and
instructions in it. But I didn’t look, in a hurry you
know. Now I think that if I don’t turn on the charger
the temp sense wire not being hooked up will not
matter and I still can go on with the engine install.
Hopefully the blocks are in the bag. No joy, I
checked today and they are missing. I called at 09:30
and again at 16:15 and no answer. Maybe I’m paranoid
but I think I’ll borrow a waitress’s phone tomorrow
and see if they will answer.
I have stripped out a ton of old wires. The wiring
from the Lectra San is going to lighten the boat
enough to even out the weight for the extra batteries.
I just gotta say I envy Rich for having the boat in
the back yard, I have to drive an hour and a half to
the boat; and Pete for his organizational skills he
gets more done in a weekend traveling from Colorado
than I get done in three months. Pete someday I’d
love to see the air compressor/ generator installed it
looks like a fantastic item.
Just needed to vent, hope I didn’t tie up your email
Today is the day! I tossed ten gallons in the new tank
and then on to the boat yard to drop in the engine.New engine room with muffler and air
cooled battery box.I had to extend the back wall to hang the
inverter in the wiring closet.The pins above the battery cable is where
the temp sense should hook upI’ve never had an original idea but I
steal the best. Mirror copy of Rich’s design.Finally made it to the boat yard
____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJPost generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
Not zincs, they are the pipe plugs…. they just used
steel plugs in a cast steel housing with a saltwater
bath….great design!!
Mine are like that, but I have chosen to ignore the
problem, for now….
alanPost generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
been there…. how can we make sailing any more fun?
— Robert Fine <> wrote:
I know how you feel – I had to wrestle the head
discharge hose to a
different point necessitating disconnecting the
joker valve housing, pulling
the hose up 1 ring at a time through sheer force,
then when able, pulling it
back down to fit the holding tank top.Yuck.
On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 2:27 PM, alan P
<> wrote:I spent yesterday replacing the 1.5″ hose for the
port midship deck drain. The one that goes throughthe
galley shelves and ends up under the aft bunk.
I once wrestled a 400 lb grizzly bear and didn’tfeel
as bruised and as beat up as I do today….
Glad I did it though because as I gently twistedthe
hose at the thru-hull, the hose just gave out. The
bottom side where you could not see was rotten andthe
wires inside were all rusted out…. another
disaster
avoided.
a
— Robert Fine <> wrote:
Hi Alan,
Glad we can amuse you. We weren’t sailing last
Monday. I, for one, was
upside down in the bilge replumbing my newholding
tank. Or something else
equally nasty.But good to hear from you!
Bob
On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 2:09 PM, alan P
<> wrote:I just wanted to let every one know how nice
this
MOnday is compared to last Monday.
Last Monday it was quiet here…no one wassending
any
posts. I couldn’t help but think maybe every
one
else
was out sailing and I was stuck working or
what
ever
it is I do here…. online most of time
reading
sailing forums.
SO…. glad everyone is back…
alan____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:
—
Bob Fine
Fine Software LLC
Your data on the web your way. No kidding____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:
—
Bob Fine
Fine Software LLC
Your data on the web your way. No kidding____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
I spent yesterday replacing the 1.5″ hose for the
port midship deck drain. The one that goes through the
galley shelves and ends up under the aft bunk.
I once wrestled a 400 lb grizzly bear and didn’t feel
as bruised and as beat up as I do today….
Glad I did it though because as I gently twisted the
hose at the thru-hull, the hose just gave out. The
bottom side where you could not see was rotten and the
wires inside were all rusted out…. another disaster
avoided.a
— Robert Fine <> wrote:
Hi Alan,
Glad we can amuse you. We weren’t sailing last
Monday. I, for one, was
upside down in the bilge replumbing my new holding
tank. Or something else
equally nasty.But good to hear from you!
Bob
On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 2:09 PM, alan P
<> wrote:I just wanted to let every one know how nice this
MOnday is compared to last Monday.
Last Monday it was quiet here…no one was sendingany
posts. I couldn’t help but think maybe every one
else
was out sailing and I was stuck working or what
ever
it is I do here…. online most of time reading
sailing forums.
SO…. glad everyone is back…
alan____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:
—
Bob Fine
Fine Software LLC
Your data on the web your way. No kidding____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
Speaking of line, what length are you planning on
buying. I need to purchase a line for my Solent Stay
Halyard / Pole Topping lift. Probably close to the
same length…. I wanted to order it before I go back
out to the boat next weekend.
alan— Robert Fine <> wrote:
Hi John,
Well, and everyone else, too. Why do you want such
large halyards? The
hoist on the main is actually shorter than my
Ericson 34 which was perfectly
happy with 3/8″ line. I’d say, use the smallest
possible rather than the
largest, but perhaps there’s something I don’t
understand yet about the 424.That said, I almost never use an eye splice for the
halyard – it wastes too
much hoist. Believe it or not, there is a special
knot whose sole purpose
is to attach a shackle to a halyard. It’s called the
buntline hitch (
http://www.the-sailors-place.com/special_knots.htm)It allows a full hoist, is easy to make, difficult
to break, and easy to
shorten the halyard when there’s a reason due to
chafe. It can be done in a
seaway (and if you’ve ever had to do that on a
halyard when tossing about,
this is important), and it’s not a bowline.You may say, “But Bob, the knot is weaker than the
splice!” Why, yes. Yes
it is. Let’s look at this: The working load for
7/16″ (11mm) Stayset X is
7,400 lbs (Stayset X is recommended by New England
Ropes for our size
boat). A 50% reduction in strength allowed for the
knot and safe working
loads works out to 3,700 lbs, or the hoisting of a
Subaru Impreza Sportwagon
with 4 passengers up your mast.The truth of the matter is that the science and
technology of cordage is so
advanced now that you could very easily have no more
than 3/8″ line safely.The only reason I can see for larger line is the
hand of the line.Again, only my two cents.
Bob
On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 11:26 AM, John Stevenson
<>
wrote:Paul,
When I purchased Sarah one of the first things Idid was replace the
wire/rope halyards with all rope with the origina
sheaves. I went with
9/16″ Sta Set X thinking it would fit the sheaves.
It did, but the eye
splice was too large to go onto the sheave and I
couldn’t get a full hoist
on the main. I lived with it (used a Cunnigham to
tension the luff) until I
swapped out the sheaves and went to 1/2″ and
7/16″.
So I can say that 1/2″ would fit easily on the
original sheaves, but the
eye splice may not. A lot depends how clean and
tapered a splice you put on
the halyard and how full the hoist is for your
main. If main hoists below
the black band you shouldn’t have any trouble,
however since I never tried
1/2″ on the old sheaves I can say for sure.
FWIW, I prefer the 7/16″ Sta Set X to the 1/2″.Sta Set X is very stiff
rope. Even after 5 years my 1/2′ halyards are
fairly stiff. 7/16″ is more
flexible and fits the halyard cleats better.
John
On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 11:10 AM, Paul Lefebvre
<>
wrote:
Has anyone tried using 1/2″ Sta-Set X in the
original wire/rope sheaves.
I may be able to get some 1/2″ for less than
7/16″ It looks like it should
fit, but I thought I would check.
Thanks,
Paul #28
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:
—
Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.com—
Bob Fine
Fine Software LLC
Your data on the web your way. No kidding____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
To unsubscribe, e-mail:
For additional commands, e-mail:Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum
